Are Photographers Artists?

Tell them "no, I'm a plumber"....just to see what their reaction is ;-)

"I'm a doctor, not an artist!" ~ Dr. "Bones" McCoy

I have never been asked that or had it implied that I wasn't. I think if anyone asked that, I'd turned right back with "Why would you ask that?" But I like Mary's reply better.

I have had the same question asked of me by other "fine artists". I have also had the same question asked of me by photographers who are still using film vs my digital images.

Either way, it is snobbery and nothing more. I ignore them, turn my back and walk away. Why even give them the courtesy of an answer at all?

ha! Mary beat me to it....a one liner would sadly, be steeped in sarcasm and win you no friends or clients.
Mad Magazine used to call them 'mad snappy answers.' I loved them!!
First time I tried it out, I was in an elevator at the dorm in college and was wearing a monogrammed blouse. Someone asked me if they were my initials...I said...
" nope, just my three favorite letters in the alphabet."
Trust me, you'll get your lights punched out if not careful!

I think most photographers would agree that they are artists...we've had many controversial threads on the subject...especially since faa has two categories ( drop down from the ARTISTS link above.)

tell them you are a "con artist"!

No, I'm an artiste. :-)

yes they can, but it really depends how they shoot the work. if it's all snap shots from vacation, then mo. but otherwise, yeah.


---Mike Savad

But if they are snap shots with a little HDR done to them and maybe the use of a few other filters, then they could be considered art. All depends on the final product not the way the initial photo was taken.

@Tiny and @Marlene
I have noticed that the attitude of other artists toward photographers is definitely changing. The two largest art leagues in my area are the Art League of Ocean City, Maryland, and the Rehoboth Art League (Rehoboth Beach, Delaware). Ocean City has always made sure that photographers are equally represented in shows and competitions. Rehoboth just announced some new photography shows and commented that this group has been under-represented in the past. So they are making an effort.

But these disagreements go on between all types of art -- that the water colorists are tying up all the show spaces, this other group does this or that and it is unfair to everyone else, etc.

I think the point is that if you like the type of artwork that you are doing, you should naturally feel proud of that genre and think it is the best, while still appreciating and encouraging others.

I've never been asked the question, but I have had it explained to me that I was not an artist, and that photography was not a "true art". Whether or not I agreed didn't matter, it was their opinion of what I did. Personally, I consider myself a craftsman. It's a comfortable place for me to be.

No.

There are millions of photographers and very few artists among their ranks. Not all who hold a paintbrush and palette are artists either.

This question on FAA is akin to asking a group of doctors if they like malpractice insurance. Mostly your "answers" are guaranteed.

Marlene reminded me of when I worked at Kohl's-we had to wear lanyards with our store ID. I was constantly asked by customers, "Excuse me, do you work here?" My standard reply was, "No, I just love their jewelry", holding up the ID. /end threadjack

It's possible people ask the question the OP has been asked due to being at craft fairs. People don't think photography is a "craft", they assume a craft is something like knitting or woodworking.

How about the ones who claim you are not a real photographer unless you only shoot on "manual". ;-)

Well said, Kim. The art world has room for many, many types and all sorts of media. Whether they are good or not, well that's either subjective (if you don't like their style or subject matter) or objective (if the work is clearly crap).

I've never had that question asked, but have had people tell me, "You should go get some pictures of...".


I've never figured out if that was a compliment or not, lol. :)

@Marlene, You are so right about sarcastic one-liners. They never work, and the people who ask about being an artist are not putting me down -- they seem to be genuinely curious about how I view myself.

@Louise, you might be right about the craft fairs. But the place where I was asked the most was at the Rehoboth Art League's yearly art show. I wonder if the question is asked because everyone takes pics with their cell phones, and they are wondering how they should think of themselves.

@Greg, yeah, I get that a lot, too. I guess it's a complement to be asked to take photos of certain views. After all, it is a place that clearly has inspired them. People like to give suggestions on how to sell my photography, so I take that as a complement.

I have had two specific requests where people have said they are interested in buying a specific view. They were interested enough to give me their email addresses for when they return to the beach this summer. Whether or not they end up buying the work or not, I now have two very beautiful and quite unique views that I think will sell. It is definitely worth listening to what people say they want to see.

wow! I learned something new today...I googled 'artist'.
Here's the big, bold, first up definition...so sorry photographers....sigh
art·ist
ˈärtist/Submit
noun
1.
a person who produces paintings or drawings as a profession or hobby.

"Are Photographers Artists?"
Are Painters Artist?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1n7pfNNP2EM&feature=share&list=RDGa3E-70u4g0&index=6

Shouldn't the answer be that you're a photographer?

I've run into a narrowly defined notion of the photographer. People assume that photographer means landscape photographer. On two occasions I've had people ask me what I do. If I say I'm a photographer they says something like "oh there must be plenty of things to shoot around here" and they motion at the trees.

Ed, you're basing an entire term off of your own personal experiences. What if you're at a show displaying your pictures and someone says "ah a photographer, and a good one", do you immediately respond with "no, I'm an artist". I'd look at that person as though they had 6 different and uniquely shaped heads if they said that.

That's funny Edward. I AM a landscape photographer, but when I tell people I am a photographer, they almost always assume I do portraits or weddings, lol.

As far as whether I am an artist or not, I don't really care much about titles. I do what I do and if someone likes it--great! In my estimation, my work speaks louder than any title I give myself. :-)

Kim, once you come up with the appropriate answer, the next question will be waiting in the wings.
My person fave is "ok, but how to you make money?"

@John, how about a fine art photographer? that conveys both images, of being an artist and a photographer. After all, this is FIne Art America.

I look on my photography as a subset of art, just as a water colorist would think of their work.

some folks just can't give this up - Some photographers ARE artists - some photographs are art - some photographers are not artists and most photographs are not art. Some artists are photographers as well.

Let's get over this !

You could answer a question with a question...

Them:
"And do you consider yourself an artist?"

You:
"Do you consider yourself an art critic?"

I like to use the the phrase "A Picture is Worth a Thousand Words" because people dont say that about paintings :)

@Marlene,
The Oxford dictionary defines artist as:
1. A person who draws or paints as a profession or hobby. A person who performs any of the creative arts.
2. Informal. A habitual practioner of a specific activity: a con artist.

Here is what wikipedia says about creative arts. Note that photography falls under visual arts. There is something in there that painters will really like, as well.

Creative arts is a subject of study for a number of universities, including those that offer a degree of Bachelor of Creative Arts. Areas of study include dramaturgy, music, graphic arts/cartooning, performing arts, film, publishing, galleries, museums, and the visual arts.

The visual arts are art forms that create works that are primarily visual in nature, such as ceramics, drawing, painting, sculpture, printmaking, design, crafts, photography, video, filmmaking and architecture. These definitions should not be taken too strictly as many artistic disciplines (performing arts, conceptual art, textile arts) involve aspects of the visual arts as well as arts of other types. Also included within the visual arts are the applied arts such as industrial design, graphic design, fashion design, interior design and decorative art.

The current usage of the term visual arts includes fine art as well as the applied, decorative arts and crafts, but this was not always the case. The current usage of the term "visual arts" includes fine art as well as the applied, decorative arts and crafts, but this was not always the case. Before the Arts and Crafts Movement in Britain and elsewhere at the turn of the 20th century, the term 'artist' was often restricted to a person working in the fine arts (such as painting, sculpture, or printmaking) and not the handicraft, craft, or applied art media. The distinction was emphasized by artists of the Arts and Crafts Movement who valued vernacular art forms as much as high forms.[4] Art schools made a distinction between the fine arts and the crafts maintaining that a craftsperson could not be considered a practitioner of the arts. The increasing tendency to privilege painting, and to a lesser degree sculpture, above other arts has been a feature of Western art as well as East Asian art. In both regions painting has been seen as relying to the highest degree on the imagination of the artist, and the furthest removed from manual labour - in Chinese painting the most highly valued styles were those of "scholar-painting", at least in theory practiced by gentleman amateurs. The Western hierarchy of genres reflected similar attitudes.

So wikipedia considers photography to be an art. Now whether or not wikipedia is a real encyclopedia....We might need a whole new thread for that one! LOL.

I think you are trying to untangle a Gordian Knot. Sticking with the "famous" for a minute: many (most I think) famous commercial photographers would have considered themselves talented but not "artists" in the defined sense. Although much of their audience would I suppose. Conversely, virtually all famous "art" photographers would certainly consider themselves fine artists and turn their noses up at the idea of "commercial" photography.

This reminds me of my son, who in school was asked what he was going to be. His reply was "I am a fashion designer." So I suppose one's designation as "artist" can be self-applied, regardless of medium.

Fine art photographer is good. I consider myself an artist that works in the medium of photography (mostly). Some days I'm just a photographer shooting documents rather than art.

BTW - I ran into something in an article that was interesting about the bias against food photography. If you shoot fashion, you have no trouble getting your work into a gallery or museum. But try that with food photography.

Shouldn't the answer be that you're a photographer?

@ John,

Yes... photographers are photographers.

So maybe the real question that needs to be discussed and answered is:

Are "photographs" (painting with light) art? (rather than is the photographer an artist).

If the answer to the new question is yes, then how can anyone disagree that a photographer can also be an artist?

@Tiny, I like that definition, painting with light....

When I was growing up, photographers were never considered artists and that's the way it was. I never knew a photographer to even ask that question.

One friend in particular, a teen who was hired by Life to shoot the coronation of the queen, probably still doesn't call himself an artist.

Then, when I forgot about photography and dove into television (Is television an art form? some would ask...), I later read about the debates, and slowly the art world started considering photography as an art form.

My feeling is that the photographer who has a definite goal in mind and sets about capturing that image that starts in his or her mind is an artist. A conceptual artist.

Anyone who works in the arts is an artist. A dancer is an artist. A musician is an artist. A photographer is an artist. There is a wide range of talent in each discipline. My next door neighbor when I was growing up painted in oils, but she was definitely NOT an artist LOL. I often didn't know how to react when she showed me her work. It was....well, I wouldn't call it art.

I have discovered photography. Now I can kill myself. I have nothing else to learn. - Pablo Picasso

Perhaps a lot of people think of photographer maybe the way it works for them ---- shoot hundreds of photos and wait for that "lucky" one. An artist visualizes what they are trying to express and then uses the tools at their disposal to achieve that result.

As both John and Tiny have alluded to, it would be plain old photographer for me.

To me photography is a craft, a skill which can constantly be refined and improved upon, something to be proud of.

Not all photographs are art in the same way not all people who take pictures should call themselves photographers.

At the end of the day if a photograph is to be considered art it's down to the viewer to decide for me, so I'd probably ask the person questioning, what do you think ?

Funny how no one attempting to answer the question has really referenced what to me is the number one determining factor that distinguishes any fuzzy line between an artist (of any medium) and a non-artist, and to me that is the ability to be creative.

We all know there are different degrees and subjective ideas as to what constitutes artistry and artistic content. The sub categories that may be included under the heading of "artist" may seem almost never ending however, the one major qualifier that is at the top of the list is creativity.

I consider anyone who uses their creative ability to be an artist, whether it's someone arranging flowers, or another who builds a house. The songstress who interprets a musical arrangement, or the person that composed the arrangement. To what degree that artist is skillful at their craft is a whole different subject.

People who may not know much about art or artists, will often say things such as what this thread quotes at the top. Most people on the receiving end of the question will probably consider the source. As someone mentioned above, you would rarely get such a question from another artist!

Would there be any advantage, in terms of prestige, income, etc., if more people thought of photography as one of the arts? Or does photography stand on its own as a discipline?

Flip the question around and you'll see the problem immediately.

When someone says "I'm an artist" what do you think that means? What image comes to mind?

Dan Turner
Dan Turner's Seven Keys to Selling Art Online

who is a photographer?
I take pictures but I certainly do not consider myself a photographer.
I have no interest in equipment, lighting, tripods and the like...but when I see a great composition, I grab it.

Just answer honestly, and say, "Yes, I do consider myself an artist." After all, the question was how do you consider yourself. It's not up to you to educate people, but hopefully they will think about your answer.

Fair point Marlene, is it primarily because you are an actual artist though, that you don't consider yourself a photographer ?

@ Brian That was nicely said. I would also like to add to creativity, skill and maybe intuitiveness.
@ Kim Depending on if you want to drive people away will depend on what response you give. You could take them seriously and answer "Yes, my photography is art." It may start up a conversation on the creative process behind your images. If you help people to feel for you work, you may get more interest in it; witch may mean more in the way of exposure and dollar signs for you.

It's a good discussion so far, but I'll bite and say photography is under the umbrella of the visual arts. And I'll spin it yet another direction.. I'm someone that tries to make my ART look like PHOTOGRAPHY. Is there a name for this type of art?? I just call it digital art, very generic I know. Best example is my latest piece.. this took me 45-50 hours to make and another 10 hours of research closely studying dozens of images from all angles to get it looking fairly realistic.

I like what Loree Johnson wrote -- "As far as whether I am an artist or not, I don't really care much about titles. I do what I do and if someone likes it--great! In my estimation, my work speaks louder than any title I give myself. :-)"

I don't know how I might reply if I were ever asked the question: Are you an artist? I don't consider myself one as I typically think of myself as a "see scene, shoot scene" photographer. I've actually given the rhetorical question more thought today after reading this theerad than I had ever done before the thread.

Anthony Wilkening: "I like to use the the phrase "A Picture is Worth a Thousand Words" because people dont say that about paintings :)"

Yeah, but both are only worth five hundred keywords!

Ian, nope. I have no interest in anything to do with cameras...I just use my iPhone camera to snap up great abstract designs I see on the streets.At best, I'm a fauxtographer

I do not consider myself an artist.

I've got to say Marlene every time I see you use that word ' fauxtographer ' it really does make me smile.

Anyway as it's 8.30 in the UK and Friday night, like any true englishman, I'm off to the pub, probably the sole time my name can really be associated with the word artist :)

Have fun all

Ian

This is a senseless discussion, I think, because an artist is someone who produces art, and art is defined not only by the final result, but by the intention of the producer, so who can tell? For example, you walk down the beach and you find a piece of driftwood you find appealing. You bring it home and you display it on top of a table. Is that art? Why? Why not?

I don't think that question should be made if you are not going to accept there are as many answers to it as people. Art is not a democracy, art is not what the majority consider art or what the "experts", "professionals" or scholars say. Art is, or is not, what you decide it is. The problem is that the answer is only valid for you XD

Well, ant then you can try to sell it, but producing and selling art are two different things and two different goals altogether. I don't think sales are an accurate parameter to value art. I don't think the one who sells more or sells better, or lives of his art is the best artist. I think he is a fortunate artist for a fact and he is probably good, but the truth is that he would be just as good if he had produced that same art and hadn't bothered trying to sell it. And nobody would tell. I think most of the best artists are out there lost like drops in an ocean.

And no, I am not one of them. And I could not care less, because I really enjoy with what I create. Don't get me wrong, I would love to sell a lot and be well considered and have the prestige and all that jazz, but that is secondary to how fortunate I am for being a person that enjoys creating things.

I think the whole concepts of art and artist are overrated.

My HO, of course.

Call yourself what you want, just don't get cocky or insulted if someone says you're a great photographer when you are displaying PHOTOGRAPHS. Maybe in your understanding of the term artist and all that it encompasses, you are an artist, but to common folks viewing pictures, you're a photographer, and it's not meant to be an insult.

Kim,
stick with what works " yes, definitely."

It is a matter of perceptions. People, even some painters on this site, often think that photographers step out their door, make a few clicks with their camera for a few minutes, and they are done.

The word "artist" implies, as Brian and Lori commented, that there is creativity, intuition and skill behind those clicks. I think it is good for people to understand the effort and creativity that is involved in our work.

I WISH I was a photographer but I am just a person with a camera

I would in no way feel insulted if called a photographer

"Funny how no one attempting to answer the question has really referenced what to me is the number one determining factor that distinguishes any fuzzy line between an artist (of any medium) and a non-artist, and to me that is the ability to be creative. "

Maybe because it is a load question...huh....

What a great question.

I will reply later, when I have time....

@H Drew, and that brings up the question, what constitutes a work of art.

Beautiful point, Philip.

To answer the question directly. Yes I am an artist. I never get asked if I am. I am always told I am or I am not. I really don't care. Just one of those things I get used to like being told my name is Martin Bradford. Whatever. I know who I am.

Are Photographers Artists? - YES! :-)

"Artist" - it's just another label and I reckon many who take themselves and what they do seriously like to have an official label.

I suppose it's like when rappers are asked if they're artists, and/or musicians. Artists don't consider them artists, and musicians think they're not musicians because they can't read a note of music lol To me photographers are artists, as long as they have a hunger to be creative, and they strive for inspiration in their work.

@Carlos. It is also a generation difference. Younger people can strongly relate to rap. Older people don't understand it, and think it all sounds the same.

Years ago, I was in Puerto Rico. From my room, I could hear a local bar that was over a mile away play the same song over and over, night after night. What started out as cute became quite maddening. One night, as I heard the song played for the millionth time, I suddenly realized that many different songs were being played, but with the same synchopation. This made them sound like the same song to my untrained ears. That's why our parents always said that all rock and roll sounds alike.

There are a lot of painters of which are only a few artists. And there are many photographers and these are just a few artists

Agree with Franziscus. The label doesn't guarantee quality, no matter what discipline.

I was told by someone I respect that if you want to sell your photography,.....

Create images that the majority of people cannot take themselves,...be as different as you can.

If you are lucky it might draw attention or interest.

Today's technology in point and shoot cameras including cell phone and ipads and such,.... have saturated cyberspace and desensitized buyers and the public at large.

When we buy something we feel that our selection is unique and different, well thought out,... and will be admired within our social circle.

Subconsciously buyers do not always buy for themselves,...they are attempting to show that they are astute and discriminate in their taste,....
To own a desired object or possess one of a kind or few available,...to please others they want to impress.

Objects that appeal to a particular elite groups school of thought,....drives many,....
acceptance within a like thinking community is more important that satisfying individual personal taste if they even have it.

The market place is flooded with work,...realy, really flooded,....exhaustively so.

Start looking through every single individual piece of art work,...one item at a time,...force yourself to do this for hours on end.

Your will be so saturated with seeing image after image after image after image after image after image.......

that content will become irrelevant and actually fatigueing and eventually loathsome.

This is what creative individuals are up against out there constantly online,..

bombarded endlessly,...seeing,...viewing,...looking,,...visiting,..browsing,..by all electronic media,...

See me,.....See me,......See me,....See me,....See me

You better have a better product,....a better idea,...a better approach,....a better niche,..a better technique,...a better plan.

Those that manage to think outside the box,....who are as creative in strategy as they are in art,....will succeed more.

Mike has a very keen insight that he shares unselfishly regularly with members of the FAA community in the discussion group,...he has very good insight.

Ask anyone who does well,...and I bet they have a plan they follow.

It's that kind of thinking that separates success from failure,....sales from no sales.

Wildlife only succeed in killing 10% of all the pray they require to survive in the outdoors.

Many repeated attempts are mandatory to increase your odds of making it,...or not.

The helping hand your looking for,....is at the end of your own arm.

It takes work,.....that's why it's called work.

No I do not practice what I preach,....but I do consider myself a fair to good observer.

The harder I work,...as time permits,...the luckier I get.

It's really all relative. One mans trash is another mans treasure.

As I understand it the word photography was derived from the Greek language, and in essence meant “To paint with light”

So are we photographers, * painters * ?

I think so. At least in the crudest sense of the word.

And when one considers that to portray a three dimensional subject in a two dimensional medium? I submit that this is indeed art.

Then again, the whole complex question of what is art has been debated for centuries.

http://www.brainpickings.org/index.php/2012/06/22/what-is-art/

Marlene wrote: “wow! I learned something new today...I googled 'artist'. 
Here's the big, bold, first up definition...so sorry photographers....sigh 
art·ist 
ˈärtist/Submit 
noun 
1. 
a person who produces paintings or drawings as a profession or hobby.

So sorry photographers? Really?

Let me ask you this, Marlene. Does your understanding of the term art come from Google?

Would you classify a sculptor as a craftsman? What about a dancer? How bout an opera singer? And a blues musician?

According to this “first up” shallow definition none of these people should be adorned with the title, 'artist'?

How nice it must be to live in a world with such simple answers. Sigh....

Question.

Should this man hold the “title” of artist?

Walter, you totally missed my point. I am an artist. I recognize photographers as artists. I even take pictures and understand what goes into knowing what is good and what is not...
I am talking about the general public...which is what the OP addresses....if THEY go and google the word artist...THAT is what is shown,FIRST UP. Go back and take another read of my comment. You missed my sigh.

Sorry, Marlene. I did misread your post.

My apologies!

Hamlet:
Madam, how like you this play?

Queen:
The lady doth protest too much, methinks.

There are those who call themselves artist and there are those are called artist by others.

I am a photographer, I make art, therefore I am an artist too. I exhibit my photography in a gallery with painters and we are all considered artists.

I've never been asked if I consider myself an artist. I'm a photographer, I leave it up to the viewer to decide whether the images I create are art or not.

It doesn't matter if others see you as an artist. The only thing that matters is how you see yourself.

I never let what other people think of me get in the way of doing what I want to do. The only person I ever try to please
is myself. You can't worry about what other people think or how they want to label you. There are way too many people in the
world that will want to do that and you can not possibly please them all. So please yourself and the hell with the rest of them
let them think what they want. Their opinion is really meaningless.

So, if you think as a photographer you are an artist, you are an artist.

Now, as an individual, do I think I am an artist. No. I have never thought of myself as an artist. I am just a guy that liked to take
pictures and owned an art gallery and started framing the photos to show off framing options. Next thing I know people started buying them.
Over 40 years I managed to find thousands of people that wanted to my photographs. Some of them I wouldn't have hanging in my own
gallery but people buy them so I keep selling them because it is fun. No other reason.

So am I an artist? Am I even a photographer? Don't know, don't care.

What department are most photography classes under in most colleges? Art, I think.

@Kim, sure..thatz right! We all know what a great job art academia has done to further most BA gradz. Those must be the real artist! They have a diploma to provide it :-)

@H Drew. How true. I do know a sculpturess who was turned down for admission by the Maryland Institute for the Arts. Not because she did not qualify, but because she was too good. The professors told her that she was so good that learning technique would only hamper her creativity. I do wish someone would tell me that about learning photoshop.

@ Kim, that is very interesting. Thanks for sharing.

I'm off to a reception this weekend as I have some photographs in a show at a gallery. I'll be waiting for that question. If asked I'll probably just smile and sigh. Of course the worse question is if one thinks they are an artist rather than photography in general. Boy, if someone asked you straight out "do you consider yourself an artist?" I'd think the person asking the question doesn't think so.

Being a photographer who has been in shows with all genres, I understand that their are certain style artists that look down upon photography. They have no clue what it took to get to an end result of a certain photograph but belittle it and say its not art. I find these are the types of people that since childhood have always been in some type of association or group to make themselves look and feel better. They are usually in art associations as adults as well. Snobs and arrogant elitists whom I have no patience for.

As a matter of fact I just heard from one of them yesterday with some kind words about photographers. Here were her exact words.

"NO worries here. I saw that almost everything posted was not actually done through artistic merit but rather through photography"

Yes, those are the words of a snob, and usually I would have sad something back, but decided to just say, good luck in the contest.

One of the all time great "artist" in my opinion, as well as a lot of art scholar, is William Bouguereau.

Go read his history and how he was often ridiculed by his peers and the so called art experts. Because he was realist
in his painting style, and one of the best that ever lived, he was scorned for his work. He was also ridiculed because of
his hand in political issues like women's rights to attend academies and universities, but that's a different story.

If Bouguereau, whose work is as close to being photo realism as you can get, is not an artist, then a photographer certainly is not.

If Bouguereau is an artist, than a photograph certainly is as well. They are both doing the exact same thing just using different tools.

How can anyone look at the work of Bouguereau and say this man was not only an artist, but one of the great artistic geniuses
in history?




Included in the dictionary definition of the word artist are the following statements:

Create extraordinary versions of ordinary objects.
Record and commemorate.
Give tangible form to the unknown.
Give tangible form to feelings.
Refresh our vision and help see the world in new ways.

Also listed in the dictionary and or Encyclopedia under Examples of Art and Artists is the work of Ansel Adams.

I'm too busy creating conceptual art to bother with what others think.

I understand in AA that there's an idea that goes: "What another person thinks about me is none of my business."

I never ask, so I never get negative feedback.

@Edward, Actually, I think people are trying to give some sort of complement. A few times, people have asked if my photographs are painting. When I tell them it's photography, then they ask if I consider myself an artist.

One of my favorite lines that I have heard a few times, is after being asked if my photos are paintings, and I say they are photos, "Are you sure?"
I am still trying to wrap my mind around that one!

@Edward, Actually, I think people are trying to give some sort of complement. A few times, people have asked if my photographs are paintings. When I tell them it's photography, then they ask if I consider myself an artist.

One of my favorite lines that I have heard a few times, is after being asked if my photos are paintings, and I say they are photos, "Are you sure?"
I am still trying to wrap my mind around that one!

Kim, that's funny.

Someone here was selling photos of Amsterdam at a show - I think it was Heather Applegate - and she told us in one thread (if indeed it was her), people actually asked her "Oh, did you go there?" LOL. "No, I took them by remote..." would be my response. Or maybe "my evil twin took these".

"No, I took them by remote..."

That day is coming...

You can buy time on some telescope right now to take pictures of the galaxy. Some PGA Tour golfer is doing it and selling them on the net.

Someone will figure out a way to take advantage of all of those cameras on all of those satellites to make money on it sooner or later.

I checked into but I don't think the prints will sell all that well.

I think perhaps the public is looking for the correct terminology . They may be looking for permission to call you an Artist.

Photography is Art of course, & photographers are Artists - they just may not want to say the "wrong" thing and appear foolish.
Photography, with all it's editing & manipulations has gone off in a whole new direction.

Hi Kim,

I've looked at your pictures and wouldn't call them anything else but artwork. The people that worded their question like that are trying to be degrading.
Tell them that your psychiatrist suggested you do photos when you are on furlough from the asylum` because it will keep you calm enough and help you not to kill.
Haha

@Janine,
I think that is true. After all, the first thing that I say is that I am a photographer, not that I am an artist.

It sounds to me like they're asking if you draw or paint in addition to photography. In most people's mind, that's what the word "artist" is referring to. I certainly doubt they mean any disrespect.

@Erica, Thank you for the complement.

Kim, some of your work is post processed with textures and other things. People who aren't very familiar with both painting and photography techniques might think it could be a type of painting. It also seems as though you don't like being called an artist, and would rather be called a photographer, but again some of your images are processed to look other than a photograph, so some might just be confused and ask you that question.

@Floyd. I did look up William Bouguereau. His work is extraordinary and extremely realistic like a photograph. With photoshopping, there are definitely areas where the line crosses between photos and certain styles of paintings.

Sometimes these type of questions are just a way for them to start talking to you,because they can't think of what else to say.. If you play along, this can sometimes translate into sales.

Steven has got it right...

Play it up... act like you are extremely honored that they would ask and then say something like.... "Oh gosh, thank you! I'm not sure I have really gotten there yet but I hope to improve every day with encouragement like yours. Now buy something! "

Just kidding... but I do think Stevens is right. It may be just an ice breaker.

This may be my very first post in any of the discussions here, so be kind!

I tell people I am a fine art photographer.
When I say I'm an artist, it feels pretentious.
When I say I'm a photographer, people ask me to shoot grad photos and weddings.

@Kevin,Steven,Floyd
I do take it as a complement being asked if I am an artist. It is a bit surprising, though, to be asked that question at an art show. But I think you are right that it is a way for customers to break the ice and start a conversation.

@Heidi. I like the fine art photographer. After all, there are many areas of photography. Wedding photographers are superb artists in their own right, covering one of the most important events in people's lives. Nevertheless, I know where you are coming from. I also have been asked to shoot weddings, which is something that I do not (think incapable) do.

One reason that this question of being called an artist came to mind is from what is happening in my locale. In the last year, two camera clubs have worked with the two major art leagues in the area to get better representation for photography. One art league sent out an announcement for a photo exhibition, along with a statement that photography has been underrepresented in the past. The other art league has clearly made an effort as well.

On the other hand, one of the best juried art shows in my area allows only a few photographers, making it very difficult to get into.

I wonder if others find that photography is underrespresented in shows and art leagues in their area?

I'm a photographer and I consider myself a visual artist.

Here are a few good one liners.


Oh, what magazine do you work for?

Why you ask, do I have too much paint on my face?

You bet I am?


Here in New Orleans, famed artist are side by side with photographers as well as photographer sharing limelight with an artist, no stigmas here. New Orleans has had many famous artist and photographers from the area. No one in there right mind would ask a photographer here in New Orleans if they considered themselves to be an artist, one of the most photographic places in the world, its architecture, food, its people the list is endless, captured by fine art photographers and fine artist.

What is very unique is most fine artist are photographers and most photographers are fine artist as well.

My camera goes with me everywhere I go, If I see an artist out painting in public I will stand next to them and take photos, they turn and look what are you doing, I reply I am making a visual painting with my camera, I am taking a photo of that bird, then I say opps it looks like that bird dropped something on your canvas and smile.

Also many times if I am in public, I will ask politely, would you move over a bit, I did not want you in my photo, I ran out of public release forms, I love it when people are so nice and see a photographer shooting and they will wait, now that is what I am talking about.

When I am out and about, I am always asked the question, what Magazine do I work for?

How about this question at an exhibit of abstract paintings?

"What were you TRYING to paint?"

to continue Edward's comment...

"Did you mean to do that?"

@Edward, I have had people insist on waiting even for a few minutes for me to take a photo, so that they won't interfere with the shot as they walk by. Now that's respect, appreciation and a whole lot of patience. One person commented, "I know you might have only seconds for the right shot, and I don't want you to miss it." There are good people and lots of kindness still left in the world.

By the way, Edward, I only say this to give you a chuckle, what were you trying to paint? If someone goes to an abstract art exhibit and has to ask a question like that, you've got to wonder what they are doing there....

@Michael, I get asked the magazine question, too. I think people see that I am taking my work (too) seriously, or perhaps think that I am taking too many shots to be a casual photographer?

I have not been asked this often, but I would answer that my Fine Art degree allows my parents to think so. ; )

Heidi Hermes and Aron Kearney...love your answers as well!

If they ask you if you are an artist you might say;"Oh no.......(shaking your head sideways)....absolutely not, I'm just showing off some snapshots I took."

Or, if they are really coming across as bourgeois, you can fall back on southern charm (but you have to lay on the accent) and say, "Why bless your heart, I do my best."

Edward & Kim, I, too, am ever-so-grateful for people who realize that the camera in front of your face is not a piercing. And I try to be as cognizant of those with little P&S or cam-phones - their images are important, too!

Philip, what a powerful quote! Thank you for sharing. Hope you/he doesn't mind if I share it further.

I also see a photographe as a historian. Whether it's architecture/dilapidated barns or portraits.

Are photographers artists? Goodness knows! I can think of one or two who are. But what sort of level of "art" is required? What is "art"?

Well, yes! This is true commitment, from the viewpoint of Business...

http://fineartamerica.com/showmessages.php?messageid=1800498

@Heidi, I like the term fine art photographer.
@Aaron, Visual artist sounds even more professional.

Anyone can call themselves a photographer if they take pictures. To say that one is a "professional photographer" makes the difference. I don't mind what anyone calls me, artist or photographer. However, there are definitely images that come into the customer's mind when you use the word photographer.

Do people think that their customers think of photography as being on the same level as other artwork? In other words, if a customer sees your photograph alongside a painting that they also like, will they choose the painting, simply because it is art and your "picture" is not? Do customers have a bias toward other artwork, or is this not an issue.

Artist, craftsman, technician.... I think it's all semantics, and rests in the eye of the beholder. There is a perception held by many that photography is a technical skill, and that the camera does all the work...but that is just as true about paint brushes, charcoal and graphite, and even wood chisels. I think there are plenty of computer hardware technicians and back-hoe operators who are as much artists as any fine art painter.

in my opinion, ART IS IN THE HEART, and anyone who does something creative for the enjoyment of others is an artist - or at least an artiste, as mentioned previously.

i never really thought of myself as an artist, but i have always been creative - i paint, sew, knit, do woodwork, photography, and it seems my digital abstracts are quite popular. it was only after my friends began introducing me with "she's an artist" after my name that i thought, well, hell yeah - i guess i am!

what the words art or artist mean to others varies, and i know there is snobbery involved around classical training and years of study and exquisite technique and so forth. but in the end, as far as i am concerned, the purpose of art, whatever form it takes, is to delight the eye, speak to the heart, or engage the intellect - so if it does that, even if I don't like it myself, it is art, and whoever did it is an artist.

I believe photography is an art form. I don't know if I would consider my self as a typical artist. I create art so I am, but also I don't feel like an artist. When I think of an artist I think of someone who is constantly creating in their mind what their next project will be. An artist is very passionate and is not happy unless they are creating art. I wouldn't say I'm passionate. I enjoy photography, traveling, and sharing it and it is nice to get comments but I am not sure what the driving force is for me. Is it the opportunity to make money off it that drives me or is it just going out and enjoying the beauty of nature and capturing it? I'm not really sure, I think probably both, but once I found this site I would say I became more driven, so maybe the money aspect is the higher driving force. I don't really enjoy going to art galleries and staring at other peoples art for hours. When I look at someones art it usually is maybe for the most part a minute or so, even for the ones I think are great. I don't really get inspired by other people stuff other than to get Ideas as to where to go sometime. I lose interest very easily. So buy the definition of an artist I am one, but I don't think I really have the spirit of a typical artist.

Many years ago I was at an art fair and one of the judges, who obviously didn't like photography said something to the effect that this photo doesn't look real.



I couldn't really respond then, it was my first biggish show, but I'm still pissed off about it. I'm doing that show again thus year - finally got accepted again.

@Steven, That's a great capture. If that's not real, then she should have told you that you must really be quite an artist. LOL.

I have a number of photos where I have done very minor editing. People like them, but say, "You must have photoshopped this." Meaning, I think, that I very heavily editied it to get the results. This is especially true of some of my sunrises/sunsets. My photo below is a perfect example. The original is quite a close color match, but people comment that sunrises are never that colorful.



@Mark, My high school art teacher emphasized that art is not about quantity, it is about quality. Some are able to capture in a moment what others need to spend hours doing. Even within my own work, I might spend hours setting up and waiting for just the right moment. Other pictures, including some of my very best work was captured in a short moment of inspiration.

Kim, as stated before, this subject comes up from time to time. Interestingly there does not seem to be as many naysayers as there have been in previous discussions. We might have to give it some time. lol

All visual art requires a concept and process. IMO, I don't think the casual photographer who takes vacation pictures see themselves as artists. With that said, those of us who have the vision; who capture a subject, a moment in time, or create a composite or an abstract from those captures are artists. Photoshop et al are tools of the photographic artist. The basic foundation of photographic art is an image. The artist who creates with their hands use tools as well. Their basic foundation varies depending on what they are creating. But the vision, concept, and process requires artistic talent. The best compliment I have received is that I have the "eye" of an artist.

"Fine art photography is photography created in accordance with the vision of the artist as photographer. " I found this on Wikipedia. If you can't believe Wikipedia, who can you believe? ;-)

@ Kim, "sunrises aren't that colorful" is usually uttered by people that get up at the crack of 10, and likely haven't seen a sunrise in person. That being said, there have been many times where I've felt the image needed to be toned down a bit because it didn't look real. And I was there, I know what it looked like.

As this was unfolding before me, all I could think was that nobody is going to believe it. This is actually the "toned down for believability" version.



When it comes to mornings like this I realize it's Mother Nature who's the true artist. I'm just the dope with a camera who was there to capture it.

@Arlene, These are great points, and I like your wikipedia definition about fine art photography. The best line that I have heard about wikipedia is that it is like a wise old grandfather who simply knows everything about everything. But still, he is a little bit dotty....

I get the same with some of my sunsets. Here in the Midwest people can't believe these colors



I tell them it's a western sunset. Sometimes someone is in the booth who has seen a western sunset, and they will add that these colors are real.

I'm being interviewed for a neighborhood magazine, one of the question they are asking is what does photography to art that is different from other forms (e.g drawing, painting etc.). I'm going to use some of what I've read here to help answer the question.

I also have other images which people can't believe are photographs, especially this one when it's printed at 16x24

It seems snobbery to me in the extreme. I saw earlier in this thread that there are "millions of photographers but very few artists". Who are we to judge what is "true art?" Is not art an expression of oneself through some medium? Cannot the lens capture beauty as does the paint brush or clay? For those of you who think you're the "true artist" while others are not, remember that there are those who would dislike your work and admire the latter. Art is in the eye of the beholder as they say. Drop the snobbery!

As far as I'm concerned, "Art," just like beauty, is in the eye of the beholder. The tools used to create it are meaningless, it's the end result that matters.

I agree with you Jeff, it's not about what medium has been used it's about the final result of what has been created and the love and passion that has been put into it. I have used all the mediums (oil paint, acrylic, pencil/charcoals, oil pastels, soft pastels, photography non-digital and digital, digital painting and so on...) and none is better than the other, I love them all the same and I consider them all Art. :))

In our FAA weekly update email, there is an article by Barney Davey entitled "20 Art-related Career Alternatives to a Full-time Art Career". It is a good article that gives great ideas for jobs that you could take to support your artistic endeavors. It is well worth a read. Nevertheless, I got a chuckle when I read career alternative #18:

18.Art photographer

In the context of his article, the suggestion fits well, but it still gave me a laugh. Here is the link:
http://artprintissues.com/2014/03/22/20-art-related-career-alternatives-full-time-art-career/

It reminds me of people that have suggested to me that if I need to support myself, I should 'get into' wedding photography, as it pays so well. It amuses me that people would suggest it as a less noble alternative to the artwork that I do. After all, aren't good wedding photographers providing people with fine artwork of the most important day of their lives?