Bad Day At The Dentist!

What an emotional story Mario, hope shes ok now

I am glad she is fine but I bet she will not go back for a little while

"here and now or at the oral surgeon later"

Dentists are too optimistic. They should just advise oral surgery. I had an extraction last year in prep for an implant and BOY do I wish I had opted for an oral surgeon. It took nearly three hours for one extraction and the resulting bone graft because the extraction went so poorly. If I ever need another extraction -- oral surgeon!!


Dan Turner
Dan Turner's Seven Keys to Selling Art Online

My molar broke in three pieces as well, so I have empathy for your wife. It took him an hour to pull that tooth out. Very bad experience. I eventually got a tooth implant and I am very happy with it.

" I eventually got a tooth implant and I am very happy with it."

Carol, how was your implant procedure? My dentist says my site is ready and I should do it, but after the extraction experience I keep putting it off. He swears the implant experience will be nothing like that, but still.....


Dan Turner
Dan Turner's Seven Keys to Selling Art Online

Going to the dentist is not fun. You know it's been an ordeal when you wake up 4 hours later at home in your recliner, and have no recollection of leaving the dentist office, or the 6 mile ride home, or getting in the house.

Mario, hope your wife is feeling better.

Implants? My dentist quoted $10k.

I've had two implants and would never use a dentist for these or to even pull a tooth -- oral surgeon or implant specialist, please. I've spent a lifetime at dentists, and they vary greatly in experience and skill. Oral surgeons exist for a reason. I'm very glad your wife is done with that procedure. The only way I keep my existing teeth in my mouth is through regular brushing, flossing and using those little in-between brushes. Some of us are just not lucky with teeth, me being one. Never get a bridge, by the way, if you can help it. They weaken the teeth used to support them. I lost more teeth this way. Dentists need to look at the whole picture. Some are good, some not. It's like anything.

I made the mistake of letting the dentist attempt a root canal on me, an hour and a half later he finally admitted defeat, at least he never charged me anything for the work he did do. Now I don't even consider it, endodontist it is! I had my wisdom teeth taken out at 18, I went to an oral surgeon and was put under, thank goodness because he had to literally use a hammer and chisel to get them all out, two of them in more than four pieces each.

How horrific.....enough to put one off dentists for life! Btw......what's the difference between a dentist and an oral surgeon......sorry for my ignorance!?

Dan, I went to an implant specialist even though my dentist said he could do it himself. I insisted, so he referred me to one. There was no pain during the procedure, and no pain after. It looks just like a real tooth, and acts like a real tooth. I wouldn't hesitate to get it done again. And if I ever have to get a tooth pulled again, I will go to an oral surgeon. They're specialists for a reason.

"...what's the difference between a dentist and an oral surgeon..."



Training and the overall $$ amount

Thanks, Carol. I think I need to make some calls...


Dan Turner
Dan Turner's Seven Keys to Selling Art Online

Thank you all for wishing Alina well, she is fine now, I just made her some minestrone soup. She is one tough cookie, she does not have the luxury of gradually nursing her self back to health, she is her totally disabled mother's full time in home care giver and has been for the last 11 years or so, I try and help her as much as I can but there are things only she can do. So any time Alina goes through something this traumatic I really feel for her.

I have learned over the years that one must really be educated in dental matters,actually all medical procedures for that matter, unfortunately like much of modern medicine it's a business and at times it can be a dirty little business. I once had a dentist admit to me, and he was an old school dentist but said to me "you know, I once treated peoples teeth, but now I'm made to treat peoples jaw bone" that seems to be the thing now, seems like everyone has periodontal disease and bone loss! Both are very expensive to treat. Removing a tooth $75. insurance pays $20. only, adding bone graph $250. insurance pays ZERO!

I hate being cynical when it comes to these matters, but I take every thing a doctor or dentist tells me with a grain of salt, I thoroughly research the matter as much as I can. I recently took myself off blood pressure medications and cholesterol medications. I have managed with a moderate diet to lower my pressure way below what the meds were doing for me and against the advise of the doctor. I see to many people who place an inordinate amount of faith in their doctors. I'm not advocating anyone do this, but I do advocate getting different views when it comes to medicine. The internet becomes a most valuable source for this, but one must be selective and thorough. The thing is this, I have been lied to many times by doctors and have seen people die because of bad medical practices.

OMG Mario that sounds awful. Sounds like your wife could use a hug, or a chocolate milk shake.

sugar free one is prob best

Dentists need to quit "Practicing" dentistry and get more serious about the whole thing. ;-)

Your right Cheryl, I just picked up her medications and I picked up two fancy Lindor orange and dark chocolate bars to give her once the novicaine wears off.

If someone gave me two fancy Lindor orange and dark chocolate bars that would definitely take my mind off the bad dentistry. (-:

Here's the deal,,From a retired dentist....Never Ever let a "general dentist" pull a tooth,,do a root canal,,do an implant, or do perio surgery,,PERIOD!

I had my fair share of performing them and I refused to do them. Yes it was more "convenient" for the patient and cheaper for the patient. But, I would rather turn away a quick buck then spend an hour drilling out a tooth that broke..

As far as implants go,,piece of cake,,much easier than extraction,,worst part is the injection and the vibration of the drill.. Yes im also a patient too and have a handful of implants...

Also, If I had to choose between a root canal and crown or an implant , I chose the implant,,root canal and crown wont last a lifetime and will end up costing more in the long run when the crown gets decay under it or the root canal needs surgery(apicoectomy)

Jon, thank you for your honesty! I really do appreciate that people as you have studied medicine and dedicate a good portion of their lives to helping others, and I do understand that sometimes it's the system that dictates what a Dr. or Dentist has to do. But some times, to be fair, things like what happened to Alina can easily happen at the specialist also, last time I went to the specialist, they wanted the credit card number soon as you come in the door, first before anything else, I thought that was a bit strange.

The doctor a maxillofacial specialist had to do an extraction, the cost was like $300., oh well, the cost of living, I get it. He proceeded to take out my tooth, he fought with it and it finally came out, but he broke the tooth next to it also, so he says to me, now I will refer you to endodontic specialist, for what I asked? he said the tooth next to it broke and now you need a root canal.

I have had root canals and I don't do root canals anymore, I said no way doctor, just go ahead and pull it, he said it would be another $300. dollars I would have to pay. I said doctor, with all due respect, I have a home repair business you know, and if a customer calls me to fix the hot water pipe under their sink and I tell them it's $150. to fix and then in the process of trying to fix it I accidentally break or rupture the cold water pipe causing a leak, how can I in all consciousness expect my customer to pay me and additional $150. for my mistake? Anyway I had him pull the second tooth and he did charge me the additional $300. for .30 seconds of effort to pull it. All I'm saying, some times even the specialist can screw up, or maybe it's not a screw up, what happened today to Alina could have easily happened to the maxillofacial specialist. I tell you what though today's dentist certainly earned his $150. for two extractions and his $250. for the bone graph, I'm sure this incident will make him think twice next time, he did not expect what happened today, I'm sure of that, but in the end he really did do good, and I don't blame him, it was one of those things, I'm glad he was able to work under the pressure of the heavy bleeding and get the job done. Not an experience he will easily forget, nor will we, especially Alina.

I have some more dental stories to tell, but I'll spread them over several different post.

The last time I went to the dentist (about two months ago), it was much the same thing. While doing an extraction, he threw his back out - twice. He had to stop and recover. One time he actually climbed up into the chair with me, on top of me, struggling to get leverage. Much the same excuse, too: he said he was trying to spare me the expense of the oral surgeon. Upon leaving I was told things would get better in a few days. It did not. I dealt with chronic pain - periodically severe - and periodic bleeding for two weeks.

He damaged (moved) the tooth next to the extraction. I am now struggling with the complaint process and will probably have to go thru the local dental society that oversees dentists. I've gone thru that before, too. The previous time it was a pretty easy process - the whacko left the tip of a file in the root canal. Much like Jon warned against, he was a newbie fresh out of dental school who decided he could do root canals himself. He couldn't. Hopefully his peers (the dental society) convinced him of that after I finished with him.

I am now using a partial (top). It's horrible, horrible! Nope, doesn't hurt one bit... it's just a horrible thing to wear.

I should never have read this discussion!!

I have a dentist appointment tomorrow....

Sorry Julie, but don't let this freak you out, chances are you will be fine tomorrow.

I've been doing something called oil pulling for around six or seven years. You get about two tablespoons of oil, I think it's sesame seed oil that's usually recommended, but you can use other oils, unrefined, cold pressed. You swish it around, it cleans your teeth and cleans/massages your gums, I have to think it helps with circulation too. The "official" directions online say twenty minutes, but that's a long time. I usually do around five or six minutes and it seems to be enough. They also say first thing in the morning every morning, but two or three times a week seems to be enough. Yeah, it's yucky but not so bad after a while, you get your system going with it. Oil pull, spit it out, rinse. Yucky, but I think it really helps. I gargle after with salt water, not a lot of salt, then rinse with clean water. After a week or two my teeth felt like they were set in stone. You can Google details, but that's pretty much it.

Another version I came across that they said was just as good and easier, was to use a wheat grass formula in powder form, just a pinch or two in some water. It is easier.

I have a dentist appointment tomorrow.

Edit: I oil pull after brushing and flossing. Someone online said to brush and floss after oil pulling, but I think it's better to before.

I met a dentist my age at a bar having a very late after work meal. We got to talking we we the same age. He gave me the low down on how a "good" dentist builds a very lucrative practice. Then he made a suggestion I had never heard before, always floss before bed. The reason is your mouth goes dry as you sleep and so the bacteria builds up and goes nowhere. He assured me that flossing before bed meant my teeth and gums would never go bad.

I more than half believe him, but promises sometimes do not work out.

Dave

Interesting thread, and Mario, I hope she's feeling better. Take care, prayers are being said.

Mario, sorry to hear your tale of wo! I'm surprised an oral surgeon would do that. Unless the tooth in front had decay on it, visible on an X-ray , he should not of broken it, let alone charge you for it. No wonder you recommended the dentist do the work. It really pisses me off hearing shit like this. Sorry for my French . Too bad you don't live in south Florida cause the guys I know are excellent.

I spent 15 years building a practice and I learned early on what my limitations were. I actually had a great network of specialist in my area that I surrounded myself with. They would help me out if I ever got into a predicament. Guys/dentists today are so money hungry that they take a course over the weekend and think they can do anything.

I remember one batshit crazy lady that came to me with implants and wanted me to do the crowns. I quoted her 15k(to low) and completed the work. She went to another dentist that stated my work was awful. So I did it over again for her at no cost. She still didn't like the result( the implants were poorly placed and her gums were really messed up). I got so fed up with her, I sent her to peer review myself. They agreed that it was not my fault or that there was anything else anyone else could do better. Thank god I knew great specialists.

Jon, as in this world there are all kinds out there, a degree or diploma mean very little, it's more about the character of the person and their love of the profession and not money that I look for, skill of course is very important as is experience. Your talking to someone who has lanced more than one of his own abscesses.

When I was a kid while playing army with my best friends with bee-bee guns in hand we were only supposed to shoot each other from the waist down, well you know how that goes. My friend Stu said it ricocheted off the train tunnel wall. That was the day I lost two front teeth upper and lower, it hurt bad I was 12 or 13, yeah I cried! I still remember the moment as if it was the other day, Stu was crying to! All until we look up at a telephone pole and see a pigeon crash into the pole and break it's neck and it came spinning to the ground, well teenage kids at that age laugh at the darndest thing, we were laughing and crying at the same time that moment.

I was to young to get crowns done, but they started the root canals, I'm talking 1970's, it was a long, painful process for a kid to go thru., we moved to Miami, and when I turned 17 or 18 I went to a small practice that looked like a house converted to a dental office. The dentist starts by injecting me above the tooth into the upper gums and my luck the needle breaks and gets stuck in the gum, ouch!!!!! The Dr. grabs what looks like a pair of pliers and starts pulling on the needle stuck in my gums.

This was the start of a long, long ordeal over much of my adult life. I finally had the crowns put in, the bottom I still have to this day, no problem. The top one another story, infection after infection, abscess after abscess, and they could not get it right, numerous doctors, every time the infection would drain from the hole left in my gums from the broken needle. It was not till several years ago, after another dentist told me he needed to pull four teeth next to it to build a bridge. Well I declined, I opted for removing my single broken tooth with the post and crown and not even trying that other procedure you mentioned the (apicoectomy).

So the dentist was not happy with my decision, said I had zero chance that this would solve the problem, I insisted, and opted for a flipper tooth, which looks really good but I hate wearing. To make a long story short, it was the right choice, no more infections, no more abscess to lance on my own, no more anti-biotics. This is where I became very weary of modern medicine, it's not that I don't believe in it, it's that human nature is what it is, and we have all types of people out there in all professions, a diploma is no guarantee of anything. To bad I didn't know you when I lived in South Florida, I could have used some good recommendations.

Thanks Lisa! She is doing just fine now.

Jon,

We had a doctor Patel in CT who has a chain of dentists' offices staffed with several dentists. He got into gassing one old lady a few years ago. Her vitals fell and the aid kept telling Patel. He said something akin to not now. He kept going. She died in his chair. His license gone, he is facing criminal charges. His chain keeps running without him seeing patients.

Dave

Mario, I really feel for your wife. I relate to her fear as well - I had a similar experience with a so-called oral surgeon when I was a teen. He ended up pulling my tooth without anesthetic as it had worn off. This gave me a fear that went into a phobia. Eventually my husband searched for a dentist that specialized in people who had suffered trauma at the hands of a dentist. He found one and this dentist, well he's got me to the point where I laugh and say "ok, come on let's get this filling over with". He started me off doing small cleanings and worked on the fear by being slow, quiet, friendly and kind. It worked and I have no phobia anymore.

To me I think your wife would do well with someone similar. No one in this day and age should have to suffer as she did and I hope she's settling well.

What gets me is the dentists behavior over the tooth - THAT behavior would unsettle anyone.

My best to Alina.

Thank you Georgina, we are booth laughing about it now, really, Alina was saying that when the Dr. said "you Bitch" for a second she thought he was calling her that, LOL but it was that he was swearing at the stubborn tooth, the second time he said it must have been when be broke the tooth in three. The novicaine has worn off and she has no pain or swelling either, as has not had to take the pain medication, hopefully a good nights sleep and she will be good as new in the morning.

Sorry to hear about your wife Mario. Hope she will getting better soon. I would advise her to follow the post extraction instruction closely to prevent dry socket.

We seem to have this romantic idea about the dignity of the medical profession, when it is really a very tough job, just like any other tough job.

Swearing is sometimes required, .. I'd say.

The masters of swearing professionals are carpenters, painters, and repair people.

All maintenance tasks that involve tools and physical labor require a minimum of swearing to accomplish them successfully.

Also, a cigarette burned halfway down its length with the ashes about to fall off, while coughing, makes a nice addition to bedside manner. (^_^)

Thanks Vu, she is doing great today, a bit sore from all the heavy traffic that went on in her mouth yesterday, but no pain and no meds other than the anti-biotics.

Robert, believe me I get the swearing part, I do it on occassion, I mean what do you say when the hammer misses the nail head and lands smack center of a perfectly normal thumb leaving a purplish tone to finger nail. I seldom say ouch, that hurt, it's more like Oh F### you son of B#####, D###it!!!! LOL!

Robert,, it is a difficult job,,,i still have nightmares about it..There were tons of great patients,, unfortunately, I remember the crazy ones more..=(

Jon, I wouldn't want it for all the money in the world! I don't know how they do it. The worst I have to worry about at the end of the day is did I glue that last pipe joint right, or did I tighten does screws, but to have think how is this patient gonna heal, or will that cemented crown hold, would drive me crazy. Not to mention, the way dentist work in an assembly line manner going from one station to another has got to be very demanding, I remember my dentist of days gone by, it was one patient at a time, now I have seen 6 or 7 patients being worked on by one dentist at once. I think I heard that dentist at one time had the highest rates of suicide over all professions, I don't know if that's still the case, but I could understand why.

I just had a root canal last week. Getting a gold crown in a week or two.

Gold really?, I didn't think that was in anymore. I hope I never have to have another root canal, ever! I prefer to just have the tooth pulled, with all the advanced technology I would think we would have other alternatives.

Mario, I had one of those oral surgeon visits myself yesterday..the dentist was good enough not to say what he was thinking - not that it would have mattered - wouldnt have heard it anyway over my moaning...bottom line is that he finally got it all - but I think he broke my collar bone from all the torque he needed to apply to dig it out! Bled all night in my sleep....thanks for listening...makes my brain feel better anyway

Dentist is one word which makes me shudder.

Seven years ago my daughter was living in Russia temporarily while her husband was working over there. She came back to the UK for a Christmas visit, and while she was here one of her front teeth broke completely in half, a bizarre unusual clean break right across the middle.

Fortunately it was not causing her any pain, so she went to a couple of dentists / oral surgeons to see about having it fixed, and was quoted on average upwards of £2000 ($3000), requiring several visits for assessment, measuring, fitting etc etc.

So she decided to hell with that, I'll get it fixed when I get back to Russia. Once back there she had a same day appointment, it was measured and fitted there and then, and it is a perfect job. She paid the equivalent of £140 / $175. Seven years down the line she has had no problems whatsoever with it, and when I look at her I can't tell which was the damaged tooth, I have to ask her to remind me.

Sorry to hear your turn came up at the dentist Newman, at least you survived it.
David, wow! $175. what a deal! I often hear and know of friends that have gone to Mexico and even Peru to get work done on their teeth and had very good experiences and saved a small fortune by doing so as your daughter's experience demonstrates.

As Jon said - money crazy - My dentist is always looking for new angles. The latest is "how are you sleeping?" They took some seminar on something or another and have a solution for any problem. Constantly updating the xrays.

Not as bad as a guy we went in high school. I think my parents paid for his kids college. Once he said his daughter had a $5,000 a month allowance

I got gold for the last crown. I thought the same thing as Mario. Gold is expensive but I guess it lasts longer.

Seems like all this dental talk and the fact I got over a pretty bad cold a few weeks ago has left my gums in bad shape, periodontal disease. So I call my dentist to do a periodontal cleaning, they scrape under the gums pretty violently. They refused to set up the appointment siteing I needed to go to the specialist,again, only to be told the same thing again, some thing I did 2 years ago and it was decided by me, no surgery to cut out anything! I went back to the dentist and they did the full mouth scraping, all was fine for two years until the cold/virus apparently affected the immune system and the gums became very irritated. So the dentist will see me on an emergency basis next week, but no cleaning, rx only and a referral to the periodontist again.

I will not go, as I will not subject my gums to surgery. So I purchased a water pik and I have started my own treatment as follows. Sea salt with warm water and 50% peroxide and water 3% strength and baking soda. This after I do 10 min. of oil pulling first with cocunt oil and then with olive oil. Once I finish I do the water pick and then I do some mouth wash, and finally clean water rinse. The final step is I get some fresh aloe stalks and remove the outer skin and place in the freezer for 5 or 10 minutes, then I place the partially frozen gel over my gums. Also some aspirin.

Will see how this goes. If this does not work I will be making some tinctures of clove and other herbs and natural products.

Sounds like a great plan, Mario. It's exactly what I would do if I was in your situation. Good luck!

Thank you Carol, oh and one more thing which is maybe the hardest part of this plan is to chew some raw garlic, I love garlic but placing it directly in the mouth and chewing it is certainly an acquired taste.

I'm also considering irrigating with bee propolis as clinical studies have shown that it's more effective than tooth planing.

I ran across a woman at the health store who used colloidal silver to get rid of infections in her mouth. Colloidal silver can be used as a mouthwash to help prevent the buildup of plaque which leads to cavities and gum disease. And it can be used to stop painful tooth infections dead in their tracks if you get to them soon enough. Google "colloidal silver" for more information, Mario.

Thank you Carol, I'll look into it, I have heard it mentioned by people I know and they swear by it also.