"i Will Pat Your Back If You Pat My Back"??

Of course.

I agree!! I've had a few people follow me, leave a comment and l/f, but when I don't reciprocate, they unfollow me!! I only go through my activity feed about once a week and if something really catches my eye, I'll say something. I spend most of my time promoting on SM and editing photos for the sole purpose of getting listed in Google. I don't have time to play the 'pat my back, I'll pat yours' game.

I honestly do no, liking, favoriting and especially no following. I'm sorry if that offends some people, it doesn't mean I don't like your art, but I just don't have time for all that, and besides it would clutter up my activity feed, I prefer to keep things as simple as possible. The back patting really is a silly game, it accomplishes nothing.

I have never looked at my activity feed. Why would I?

Dave

I am with David....I will comment on something now and again that catches my eye here and there when I am out and about the site. Very rarely I follow someone. Not being rude, I am just so busy creating, listing and marketing my work. Crazy busy!

Well, aren't we just the pity ones? Ever hear of just plain politeness? If some other artist takes the time to compliment my work the least I can do is find something I like about theirs. Conversely if I compliment another's work there is not (on my part) an expectation of reply. But stil it's nice. It's a tough enough world for us artists out there (outside of our immediate family and friends, of course). Simple politeness costs nothing, returns much.

If an artist and I strike up a rapport over time more power to us, but it is not a back and forth thing.
Emails yes, but not comments, follows and likes. That said one famous poster here never follows anyone
back, has his commercial reasons. I used that advice for the longest time. I just dumped it.

I believe open sharing people do much much better in business. That does not mean I want a tidal wave of
non business communication outside of the forum, but business does better on openness.

Likes, follows, comments are only a small small part of openness. Not hugely important.

Dave

Kevin, I am very polite, I reply to every comment with a thank you.

David, the activity feed is very important to me, it lets me know when there are new contests and when my artwork is featured in groups and when my artwork receives comments. Maybe it's not important to you, and that's okay, we don't all do things the same way.

Right on, Diana! It needed to be said and you said it eloquently.

Well after reading what Sharon said I feel better after a pretty crappy day. Her comment on my photo meant a lot to me already but after reading this thread it means more.... Thanks


Edited to add

I don't think its a tit for tat type think either.... If someone comments or whatever on my photo and I have some time I will look at theirs, but will only comment if I see something I really like. I am not going to do it just because I feel like I owe them

I am not sure I said exactly what all I meant...I do not go around looking to like/comment on people's work just so they will do the same for me. I administrate 3 groups and I feature work that I find striking, unique or just plain unusual. It's nice if someone says thank you or comments on one of my pieces, but I do not expect it, nor do I begrudge it when they don't. Life is too short for that. There is a lot to do here (for everyone)! So if I comment on your work I REALLY mean it!

"I don't think its a tit for tat type think either.... If someone comments or whatever on my photo and I have some time I will look at theirs, but will only comment if I see something I really like. I am not going to do it just because I feel like I owe them"

That's the appropriate attitude IMO.

That still going on?

Diana I just commented on one of yours...I liked and favorite it too. But do NOT look at my work!

I feel like you do...I do not want to start that whole back and forth thing. I never have left a comment expecting anything but when you get one it is hard not to reciprocated by at least looking at their work for something you like. Am I not right? Some sort of guilt kicks in that makes you think saying thank you is not enough...

And then saying thank you at times is impossible...you missed the comment only to see it months later...then what to do?

May be that famous poster who does none of it is right...or maybe we need rules on how to be politically correct with this sort of thing :)

I feel bad when I don't get around to reciprocating sometimes. I'm not offended though if I've commented and don't receive a comment back, i.e., I'm the 'first' one to comment - I am not fishing for one back, if I get one, that's great but not gonna blacklist 'ya if you don't! Don't like people to feel obligated and I realize it is hard to make the time to view other work when you are trying to make/create/promote your own.

Melissa that is the thing...time. I guess some people have more of it. I work 40 hours a week and try to do art at night and on my days off...plus family and the house work, laundry and grocery stuff...it is hard. A lot of the time I don't even look at that feed thing because I know if I don't respond I will feel guilty. I like to come here but don't always have time for that.

I like the "like" button on Facebook for comments....It's a quick easy way to say "thank you" without typing.

I do try to thank everyone that comments but that is becoming increasingly hard, not enough time.....

It's been said that, "Business attracts business."

That is all...

Well, don't get me wrong.... I thrive and learn every minute from all of you! If one doesn't spend time on other's works, than you will never grow... If it weren't from all your amazing photos I would never be challenged! Just know that if I comment on your work, it is because I truly love what you do.. So don't reciprocate unless you truly like something of mine.

Diana, I love your integrity! Thank you for setting an example.

If I get too many comments from the same people over and over, I tend to think of them as being more friendly rather than truthful.

Great thread by the way!

David King your post about not having time made me laugh, nothing personal of course it's just if you have time to be in these discussions you must have time to press a button when someone is being kind to you and saying they like your work.

I agree with with Kevin C. politeness cost nothing.

Mario, I'll admit I've spent entirely too much time in the discussions today, but I had been doing better, hardly posting at all for the last few days, I just slipped up a bit today. Also, it's more than pressing a button. I'm not going to "like" somebody's artwork just because they "liked" or commented on mine. I'd have to spend time looking through their portfolio to see if there is indeed something I do like. I do thank each commenter, I think that is plenty polite. "Liking" something I don't isn't being polite, it's acting without integrity.

I heard today FB was coming out with a dislike button. Lol I bet that will bring a lot of those who never like anything out and start pressing buttons. Lol

How can you tell whether someone is fishing for a compliment or just giving you one? I don't get many comments here, but when I do I generally respond with a 'Thank you.' I've never felt that I was obligated to do anything beyond that.

https://twitter.com/seacorc
https://instagram.com/seacorc/

Mario,

I saw that too. I wonder if it is a common rumor on FB.

There genius is keeping it upbeat. Putting in a downbeat is going to change things a lot.

Dave

@Val -- Did I just hear you suggest more rules?!?!?


~ Wendy runs screaming into what's left of this night . . . . ~

That is precisely why I rarely comment on others work,,,I don't want them to feel they have to comment on mine,

When I comment on a work, I never go back to see if the artist has replied. If I want a conversation, I'll PM them.

I can't imagine many people go back to check their comments, and frankly I think all the "thank you thank you" makes the comments difficult to read. If I'm reading the comments, It's because I want to see what other people have to say about the work!

And it never occurred to me that people would feel a need to reciprocate. I comment when I'm excited by an artwork, I fave when I know I will want to see it again. If someone wants to comment back, that's ok with me, but I sure don't expect it.

As far as time goes....I was invited by multiple people to join the discussions here. There are people that I have helped in a meaningful way at some point. The complaint was that very few of the better/best sellers on FAA ever come here. So I've now made it a little part of my daily routine. Some days I scan the topics and I have nothing to contribute, so I don't. But I do believe that sharing experience and resources helps us all. I feel I have something to offer most of the time. And if someone can learn something from my failures or successes then I feel I am being "polite" to come in here and share. I report issues so that we can all learn how to deal with them. This is on top of my daily physical therapy routine, raising an autistic kid, house/home duties, creating art, listing and promoting myself and cross promoting others. So if you comment on my work and come back later and do not see a "thank you" under it, I am not being rude. It really is a time issue!

I absolutely agree. That said, I will happily and willingly comment on images I like, with no expectation of reciprocation. It costs me nothing, and just might make someone's day.

As for saying thank you when someone leaves me a comment...I see no point. They usually don't see it anyway. I would rather take a look at their work and comment IF an image particularly impresses me. I find that a more useful way to thank them.

Good point, basically I agree with everyone in that post.

This cost nothing to make polite comments even if I may not like someone's work too much but I am trying always see sth good in someone's work.

If I comment, I noticed it simply pays off.

Nobody force me to comment, I am doing it because i want to.

If I follow somoene and he/she wil not follow me then....oh well...maybe they simply do not like my work OR do not bother to look at activities. Simply as that.

I realize that many works are commented because I have made some comments but from the other side I am a member of that specific groups where everyone are trying to help each other to be viewed in a crowd of artists here and I personaly find it sweet and beautiful side of human being.

Kate Black, my thoughts exactly.

I follow someone because I like their particular style of work, I like to see what they are producing, not because I expect anything in return. And if somebody has taken the time and trouble to comment on my work, I don't see the problem with having a look at theirs, especially if it is somebody I was not aware of previously, and hopefully I may see something of their's to comment on.

As Kate says politeness costs nothing, or am I being overly polite because I'm British, after all we do have a reputation for it!

As for people who say they are mad busy or just don't have the time, slow down, you'll give yourselves a heart attack!

"I heard today FB was coming out with a dislike button. Lol I bet that will bring a lot of those who never like anything out and start pressing buttons. Lol'

Mario, I wish they would. People lover to be critical and negative when given the chance to hide behind anonymity. And of course people love controversy.

I think a dislike button would actually draw more people to a post. I can see a lot of people saying, wow, a lot of people don't like this, I have to go see how bad it is.

And I am being serious.

I answer all comments and then go and check out the commenters' work and comment, like, fave, follow, sometimes Pin....whatever I am moved to do. It's just how I've always conducted myself, whether on YouTube, Pinterest, here, or any other site that allows comments. BUT...I never expect anything from others. If you expect things in this life, you will always be disappointed. "Expect nothing and accept everything" - Sir Anthony Hopkins

A dislike button is also good for certain posts like "My dog just died".....I always find it weird when there are a bunch of "likes" for that.

I agree with the OP but the problem is, we are told that those things are help with search ranking. I don't see this as any kind of false pat on the back or ego thing. I think they are just honestly tying to improve the possibility of selling something.

I don't do any of the like, favorites, comments or other things that were pretty much part of the FAA culture going back to the beginning years. Never got caught up in that to any degree.

Coming from a advertising and marketing background, I recognized that as a losing proposition pretty much from the beginning. Getting seen by the artist members of FAA was not and is not going to sell art.

I watch the activity flow and I follow certain artists because I want to see what the big guys are doing.

40 hours a week at the day job. Another 40 creating images/marketing, a family, and of course a workout regiment to prevent heart attacks.

Posting here = useful to many members. Posting a comment because someone commented on one of mine is NOT helpful to really anyone at all. (Especially if it is a disingenuous comment just to make a comment.)

There is one image I like to use as an example even without posting it. It has hundreds, and I mean way more than 200 comments about how it is the best image of the scene since sliced bread stopped shooting images. The problem is it is so blurry, and not an artistic blur, that it probably wouldn't pass QA as a card. Yet, this person probably thinks it is the end all be all. Does the artist feel good about the image because of the comments? Probably. Would it be more helpful to tell the artist that the image sucks and needs to be reshot and the scene is frankly duller than ground down butter knife. THAT would be useful to the artist. The OMG this is soooooooooooo nice comments are not other than a kumbaya kind of feeling.

I quit the groups I was in because of this. Maybe throwing out the baby with the bathwater, but after participating in a l/f/v discussion when I first joined, it just felt so hollow. Doesn't seem to serve a purpose, either. I thought the groups would be more personal, but it seems this discussion forum has more meaningful interaction.

lol...after this discussion post Diana, I don't think you really have a need to worry about it anymore ;)

Really Floyd, you think so? Well, let me relate a story of FAA. Nearly at the beginning of my coming on FAA in 2007 I saw and commented on another's work (that someone is scarce on FAA these days). The artist wrote me to thank me and said that they were near to giving up art, as they were told their "style" was no good and they could never make it. We have corresponded much over the years but in the beginning I pointed out the strengths of the work and the uniqueness. That person relocated to another state, got a gallery and has been selling steadily for the past several years. Just the other day the gallery came and took ALL the work to be hung and sold.

You never know where a little kindness might lead. And yes, for sure, not one bit of all of that made me one single penny, but I am richer for it by far.

When I first uploaded images here I got a bunch of unsolicited comments immediately. Felt good until a few days later when some of the people complained that I hadn't commented or like any of their work in return. Put me off the whole comment thing and I still don't trust that any new comment doesn't have an ulterior motive behind it.

From reading all of the comments here...Seems to me....Do whatever feels RIGHT for you! Period. Have a nice day everyone!

Most of the people know when their work is good and when it is not

Receiving comment "soooooo gorgeous" on work that i know for a fact that sucks will not persuade me that is different. Reading that kind of comment only make the "cartoon cloud" appear above my head with "pfff, are you blind?" message.

It is all about marketing...more comments, more likes, ( maybe more sells) ,highier in ranking....so I heard.

Now Katie, you are really talking about something a bit different. Giving an over the top positive comment on a less than good work is (I think) not what we are speaking of. Yes, I sometimes need to search for just the right nice thing to say, but if the work is not good I am never effusive. Still, we must make room for those of perhaps less discerning attitudes to "like" something we consider only average or worse.

JC, the image you mentioned would probably not have more than 200 glowing comments unless it was part of a group promo or reciprocity activity. The group promos have increased so much lately, I'm considering leaving a few just to make my Group tab more manageable (and peaceful). I participated for a while, but I'd rather spend my time elsewhere now, and my comments have died down considerably since I curtailed my group visits. Not complaining, because that is fine. I'd prefer to give and get sincere comments.

Is it any different than following 100 plus people? Some look at this as a business venture while others look at it as a social venture. I have never looked into a portfolio of someone who has liked my work and not found something positive to comment on. Takes less time than trolling on these threads.

i never write comments. i remember once i had a spam type comment -- nice job, over and over. pages of them. i emailed him and told him to never comment on my images again unless he plans on writing something real. i erased all his messages. many put them down thinking they will some how inspire a buyer to click on them. but i think if they were it would be on someone that left a block of information.

i follow one family member, just to see if she would get business from it... so far no. i take the comments in. anything with $ale in it, that's erased. anything else, if they were expecting praise back, they aren't getting it. if they have a question i answer it. except for the person asking to buy it for her etsy page, then i found it was already there.

i usually read the comments each day as they get to my box.

---Mike Savad
MikeSavad.com

"It is all about marketing...more comments, more likes, ( maybe more sells) ,highier in ranking....so I heard."

Here is the issue with that logic Kate.

Yes, likes and favs help in the search but the help is minuscule. What really really helps is sales, both by the artist and of the individual art image. The other thing is keyword relevance.

What that means is if you are using the whole vote trading scheme as a marketing tool or philosophy you are doomed to fail. It is a GIANT time sink. What else could you do with that time? How about market offline or at least off FAA. How about create more art? Those two things are far more likely to lead to sales than vote trading and sales WILL move you up in the search leading to more sales.....

Now, I am not saying don't comment or vote or share or or or...... If it makes you feel good then great. I do it myself WHEN I like an image. I am saying as a marketing tool it is a very poor tool.

On my AW have stopped any comments. When I am doing business, should I do business, I want the client
to see only the art. A popularity contest is a totally worthless distraction.

Dave

Do what you want to do. But don't pounce on others that do it differently, and without hurting you...

DK,

If you are still around, the activity feeds are interesting. I am getting into that. Thanks,

Dave

Although getting comments is very kind, I really don't think that all the love from my fellow artists will get me more sales. I'm creating a new style of art so good luck to me.

For those of you who are "in style" and selling, congrats to you! And I mean it, you are awesome if people buy your prints!!

The other day, however, I met a woman who said she researched me on Google and she was excited to change one of her bathrooms to match one of my shower curtains. Although, I was charmed, I believe that the most important thing for me right now is to master my style.

If any of my work sells, that would be swell, but if not, that is life. Sometimes we succeed and at times, we don't. I do believe, however, that you can basically decide how successful you are by your sales. If no one wants your work...well maybe you should consider another job. It is brutal, but not everyone who dreams of being an artist is ready to put forth the effort to sell. Follow the money, if you are not making sales, your work is undesirable, and as hard as that is to believe, one must get past the compliments of mom, dad...and fellow artists. Follow the money, as brutal as it is.

I have to admit that yesterday I read a lot about marketing here, sales, comments, votes, your all messages etc. and it has changed everything for me.

I am setting FB, twitter and maybe google+ too and gonna start marketing my works as best as I can. Instead of spending too much time for comments that not bring nothing positive to artists (except for ego), I rather devote that time for making new art ( especially that my art is time consuming) and for marketing them OUTSIDE the FAA.

That is what I want to do. As I see no progress in sales by commenting other people that are trying to SELL too, not buy. I wish them all the best and huge sales!!

As Floyd is writing in his articles it is a marathon not a sprint, so I know it will take some time to see any changes but I will stay positive and patient ( like he advises) and learn from more wiser artists here who have bigger expierience in salling art.

I am not saying I will not comment at all...no....I will just comments this what I realy would love to see in MY house.

Have a good day to all!!! it will gonna be busy weekend for me.

Too many times I've had the snide, sarcastic and some good intended comments in my art adventures over the years (not in the FAA community), certain scenarios over time taught me that My opinion only matters what I want to portray with my Art style, some may get it, some may not, so what if they make a comment or not. Artist from the dawn of time have been getting the "knife in the back" by other artist, critics and community, at this point i can safely say i really really don't care about that stuff now. All i care about is getting some part of me on either a physical or virtual medium.That is what, at least from my point of view should matter and not words associated with any open or hidden meaning.


Just your Art.