Art Is Lie, Art Is Not Truth - Pablo Picasso

I believe the actual quote is "Art is a lie that tells the truth" That might be a condensed version of this quote though,

“We all know that Art is not truth. Art is a lie that makes us realize truth at least the truth that is given us to understand. The artist must know the manner whereby to convince others of the truthfulness of his lies.”

To me it seems like a lot of meaningless double talk.

Personally I would rather read all those spam threads than ponder such things.

yeah its really a double talk

cup is half empty of water and other statement is cup is half filled of water.
so there is a trick to say that artists has all the efficiency he can show the truth and lie and art can be a mixture of both.


Thank you

Rupesh

One interpretation of what he is saying could be that as artists we are interpreting reality in our canvases but of course there is no reality in our paintings, (even a hyperrealistic painting is an imitation of reality), therefore they are a lie, however a competent artist emphasizes aspects of reality in his painting to make a statement, to call attention to something others might not notice but which is real. I'm not sure that's what Picasso was trying to say though.

Each one of us is a lie; a collection of temporary ideas and opinions.
An artist communicates their lie such that others find truth in it.

That's what I take from it...

This is the kind of statement the public expects artist to spout at art openings. Good to have a few of these chestnuts in your pocket. lol.

....

"Every photograph is a lie, but it is within that lie that a mountain of truth is revealed! And the climb toward that mountain of truth is greatly accelerated when one's steps are rooted in the simple understanding of exposure." -Bryan F. Peterson

Of course art is a lie, it mocks reality, supplants the creativity of the mind and circumvents productivity. It deceives its protégées that they have actually created something when in fact all they have done is rearranged reality.

Art is an illusion. It is paint, or graphite, (or some other art supply) -- it is lightwaves hitting your retina and visual cortices in a way that you interpret as something more than paint or pencil.

The illusion is the lie. The art tells a truth.

Smoke and mirrors, a wave of the wand, and a bird flies out the window...

We are magicians, conjuring worlds made of nothing but reflected light.

Art IS a lie. And that's the truth.

Plain perception does not give us any truth.

Now, the artist comes along and plays the role of an interpretor, he/she does not paint the perception but an interpretation - aka a lie.

However, thanks to the artistic interpretation of the perception ( the physical outfit) we have a lie that makes us realize truth, at least the truth that is given us to understand.

Robert: Therefore, a lie IS the truth.

Lutz: I always thought that was Picasso's point. But then, it's such an enigmatic quote, and Picasso was (and still is) nothing if not enigmatic himself... I've never been absolutely certain I understood it as Picasso meant it.

My guess, although I have no facts to substantiate this, is the quote is a translation from French or Spanish. I'm guessing this because Picasso was a Spanish citizen who spent much of his life in France, there would have been no reason for him to be speaking English at the time. You can find instances on the internet where the quote reads "Art is the lie that makes us realize the truth."

Cheryl,

a mere perception is nothing without a notion we add to the perception in our mind to "see" what we are looking at.

Now, the artist does not settle with adding the notion in his/her mind - he/she visualizes this commen human activity into a drama that could make you "see" for real.

Lutz: Right. Through art you observe abstract truth that you would not necessarily otherwise notice. Some art is very simple, or seems very simple, though.

Your abstraction of a fox, which you posted the other day -- what is the "truth" in that painting? There is nothing of human activity or drama in that painting, other than human observation of "fox."
Or is it enough to simply transform paint into the illusion of a fox?

I would argue that it *is* enough to simply transform paint into the illusion of a fox, more is not demanded of art. Some art has more --- the messages can be very complex -- but additional levels of complexity are a choice made by the artist, not a requirement for a fully realized work of art.

When it comes to illustrate my philosophical statement above using a perception of a fox,

I would like you to google for Franz Marc's paintings of foxes instead. Or Picasso's paintings of cats maybe.

Maybe the notion "reveal" is a keyword here.

Ok, I'll take a look. But this is about *all* art.
I think Picasso meant it to apply to all art, it should apply equally to your art, or mine, as well as to Fraz Marc's or anyone's, including Picasso's own art.

http://www.the-athenaeum.org/art/by_artist.php?Artist_ID=153

There is a tag on this image that says it's in the public domain, so I think it's ok to post it here.

Quoting: "it should apply equally to your art, or mine, as well as to Fraz Marc's or anyone's, including Picasso's own art."

Haha, that is a good one, Cheryl! Just because you or me are skilled in the craft of painting that does not make us artists that can reveal the true nature of things and nature in our images... I for one am satisfied when I paint something I would hang in my house.

"To describe something as a Lie one must first determine the Truth"

- Richard Reeve
ReevePhotos.com

Art never lies, it is only an object representing an idea. If it represents an idea which is false it(art) is not responsible for that representation. Only the viewer can make such a judgement. People lie.....yes but it is not transferable into fine art paintings and sculpture (signs and advertising art excluded).

If he said this I do not think Picasso meant art to play the role a deception does. Many things he has said have been taken out of context since he was a Spaniard with a French tongue. Also Picasso was not one to talk much ...he illustrated his meaning in emotionally painted language.

Lutz: ?? Are you saying that you and I are not artists? Not in the sense that Picasso meant in that quote? That his quote applies only to "Art of Extreme Greatness"?

My comment wasn't intended as a joke. I don't think it's hubris, or an exaggerated sense of the value of my own work, to say that my paintings are art, and that they perform a transformation from paint or graphite into an image that is, in some small way, truth. You don't have to have status as a "great artist" to speak the truth through art, any more than you have to be a great writer to speak the truth through the written word.

Vincent: "I do not think Picasso meant art to play the role a deception does." I agree. I don't agree that art never lies... there's plenty of political propoganda art out there that was created for the primary purpose of deliberately distorting the truth, also photographic evidence is can be tampered with, for purposes of distorting the truth. We can argue about whether propoganda and/or evidence photos qualify as "art" -- that could be a long debate -- but they illustrate that the written or spoken language is not the only language that can be used to convey untrue messages.

Yes Cheryl, that is what I figure, that his quote applies only to "Art of Extreme Greatness"?

However, artist is not a titel or profession that needs any approval. So, of course we are artists! We decide ourselves.

Ok, I beg to disagree -- and Picasso's not here to tell us which one of us is correct -- or maybe we're both wrong and he meant something else entirely.

Anyway, if you see it that way, then one must first screen art for "Extreme Greatness" -- or, for what Picasso would have understood to be "Extreme Greatness" -- before getting anything of value out of Picasso's comment. That is hubris, trying to second-guess what Picasso would have considered to be "Truth."

"...of course we are artists! We decide ourselves." Not if we're trying to figure out what Picasso meant by "art" in his quote. In that context, and that context only, *Picasso's* concept of who is an artist, or which paintings are "art" would be the definition applied.

I once had the nerve to ask Picasso the question, 'What is art?' He answered, 'Art is a lie which makes us see the truth.' (James Dickey)

Brian: Interesting. It's good to know more about the context.

In the long run, I believe everybody becomes an artist, I mean like two generations from now. It is simply human development. But of course there will be "greater artists" as well, it is human too.

Twenty years ago I had customers, mainly women, who collected my art. Today they are artist-neighbors at artfairs...

There are no absolutes; art is a lie that suggests the truth.


It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye.

Cheryl;

When you say "art' I'm guessing like me you mean work of serious artists who reveal truths.

If you read my statement I pointed out that the only instance where lies are transferred into art is in signs and advertising which would include your propaganda.

In these media art work no matter how well made still does not tell a lie because the idea behind the work does that. So really people lie and ideas are promoted good and bad like those communist posters of the 1940's and the Nazi posters. The actual art work made in these cases is not really fine art at all because it does not come from the mind of an artist...it comes from the mind of whoever paid that artist.

So art if it the indeed best of humanity tell us only one thing and that is ........what the artist sees.

Vincent:
When I say "art" I have a great deal of difficulty deciding with any certainty what is art and what is not. There is no clear boundary, in my opinion. I, personally, don't limit art to work by serious artists, or artists who reveal great truths, I think the term encompasses a much larger field than that.

I didn't understand that you were including propoganda in the category "signs and advertising," although now that I'm thinking about it, that categorization does make sense -- if you accept the premise that signs and advertising cannot be art (I disagree with that premise, but that's a different debate). I used propoganda as an example of art that lies, but if you don't consider propoganda to be art, it's not a very helpful example. A better example might be portraiture that conveys a false impression of the subject's beauty or personal characteristics could be said to lie -- we have portraits like that in many museums -- it's harder to argue that portraiture does not qualify as art.

Also, you seem to be drawing a distinction between (a) the artist lying and (b) the art lying which is interesting... I'll have to think about that, the separation of the artist's lie and the painting's presentation of the idea. I guess a painting could be a "true" representation of an artist's lie? In that case, the artist who makes the propoganda is lying, but the propoganda is a true representation of the idea - the lie - that is communicated.

******
RE: "The actual art work made in these cases is not really fine art at all because it does not come from the mind of an artist...it comes from the mind of whoever paid that artist."

This statement excludes from the realm of "art" almost all artwork done on commission for a patron -- is that what you intended?
The artists who did the Nazi propoganda were commissioned to do it. In my view, commissioned work is a combination of the ideas of the patron and the ideas of the artist - but the artist is usually credited with creating the work. There are countless works of art that were created on commission by a patron, other than Nazi propoganda, that are currently on display in major world art museums, and are routinely classified as art by most people, and are routinely considered to works by the artist, not the patron.

Art is I meant it is "art work" done. It's something created and made by people who are skilled enough to do it.

No lies are in talent but what sets the most successful artists apart from the less successful ones is not just original talent but originality of thought. A novel, film, painting, sculpture...has to be not only well crafted but be stimulating to an audience to get noticed as something worthwhile.

Talk about signs as art....... Yes they are artful as craft but still commercial representations of the thoughts of someone besides the sign painter.
Therefore no matter how artful the craft of sign painting is it is mostly relaying a message that points to something greater than itself.

That's why I am happy to have quit the sign business. People do not appreciate them. Some of the work I have done turned out to be greater than than what my signs represented.

Vincent: "That's why I am happy to have quit the sign business. People do not appreciate them. Some of the work I have done turned out to be greater than than what my signs represented."

Yes, people don't appreciate commercial art as much as they should. I do notice signs, the really good ones, and I wonder who the artist was. They never get credit, I've never seen an artist's signature on a sign.

Cheryl,
yes there are really great commercial artists and always have been. The illustrators were such like Rockwell. In the sign business there are many abstract pin stripers with all art and no sign in their work. Using mother of pearl and gold effects layered on glass many are stupendous works of art indeed. There are sign art collectors and some galleries out there in California especially I think. The sign business was "California enhanced" where artists and muralists would be the sign shop owners!

In my case I would put too much effort at perfection in even the simplest sign job. I decided in my maturity that my energy is best spent on self invented at works from now on!

The "King" I guess would be MikeJackson, Jackson Signs in Jackson Hole, Wyoming. I learned a lot just looking at his carving and lettering.
It should be noted that in the commercial art and advertising world world signs have always brought in huge amounts of money. Some shops I have been in have produced extremely creative signs of all types including neon. I have incorporated neon in my fine art abstract painting, plexiglass back-painted works, enamel on metal and wood and cut & routed metal for sculpture.

If there are any artists out there who want to make money for their creative efforts; signs are a very good way!

We are in the escape business.

Back to work.

Dave

My favorite art teacher once told me that in his opinion, Pablo Picasso gave the art world a black eye, and he was glad when the "old fool" died.

JL:
The joys of being famous. People say all kinds of interesting things about you.

"he was glad when the "old fool" died."

^That's what he said! ;)

Looking at PIcassos' art - I suppose he knew what he was talking about.

Rupesh,

I was looking at your work posted here at FAA, and noticed you have your location listed as "Pune, Maharastra - United States" under your avatar. I'm thinking it's just a typo perhaps?

Based on Brian's post: "I once had the nerve to ask Picasso the question, 'What is art?' He answered, 'Art is a lie which makes us see the truth.' (James Dickey)"

It looks like a writer was interviewing Picasso, or similar situation, and Picasso had to come up with an answer that sounded reasonably intelligent.
I suppose, if you're a VERY famous artist, or a very famous anything, sports figure, politician, whatever, you think about, and prep yourself with good sound-bytes for what you might say if someone sticks a microphone in your face and asks you a question like "What is art?" or What is soccer?" or "What is government?"

Maybe Picasso was saying something deep and wise -- a great truth for the ages of man, maybe he was being "an old fool" who made something up at that moment without really thinking about it, maybe he had thought about it and this was the best answer he could come up with, but it's only partly correct, or correct sometimes.. and well, one must say something when confronted with the microphone in the face.

The more I think about "great art," the stuff we have hanging in museums, the more I don't think making people see some great "truth" is the point of most art. Not most floral paintings... not most landscapes... not most still life arrangements... I can think of large numbers of so-called "great" works of art that have nothing of "great truth" about them. Small truths, yes, "great truths" not a requirement, not even present in most art.

"Maybe Picasso was saying something deep and wise -- a great truth for the ages of man"

Sure he did! No need to speculate - he was just referring to what he was doing morning to evening. Just buy a book of his work and see for yourselve.

" I don't think making people see some great "truth" is the point of most art"

Why mystifying it by calling it "great truth"? It is just about revealing or visualizing the nature of artefakts and nature aound us instead of merly copying the surface.

What is Truth???

Truth is the state of not being hidden.

"It is just about [1] revealing or visualizing the nature of artefakts and nature aound us [2] instead of merly copying the surface."

[1] Agree.
[2] I would go so far as to include the copying of the surface... which is what photorealistic painting or drawing, and photography (photography that hasn't been manipulated) are. Much of fine art is the artist drawing or painting what s/he sees.

****
Denise... We're already debating that... or, debating what Picasso meant by that. What do you think truth is...!?
Lutz... "Truth is the state of not being hidden." ?? No such thing as hidden truth? Truth obscured by lies? Undiscovered truth?

When you search for quotes by the artist, Pablo Picasso, most of them to me seem to be somewhat unflattering to the subject of art in general and quite the "jab" or "quip" whether it be off the cuff, or well thought out. For me, they are also difficult to understand, but I'm sure most quotes are usually read out of context not to mention, they were generally said for an entirely different time in history. If you want to share a quote, I suggest looking for something more "timeless", so that the meaning is less con-screwed over the ages.


This idea of art for art's sake is a hoax. (Pablo Picasso)

Enough of Art. It's Art that kills us. People no longer want to do painting: they make art. (Pablo Picasso)

People want Art. And they are given it. But the less Art there is in painting the more painting there is. (Pablo Picasso)

Art is a finger up the bourgeoisie ass. (Pablo Picasso)

Art is the elimination of the unnecessary. (Pablo Picasso)


For many more pages of Picasso quotes on a variety of subjects, check out this link...
http://www.art-quotes.com/auth_search.php?authid=72#.Ve4offQohJc

My mother knew Picasso before he became famous. She was from Nice and Picasso was a friend of her brother. She does not like the man. She said "Picasso is a real asshole". She could not understand how he can get so much money for "the garbage" he sells. If he came on the TV, she would get very angry. Funny, I never cared for his work.

Brian: LOL. Joke's on us, we're taking Picasso way too seriously. Although there is at least a small grain of truth to all of the quotes above...

George: That's a very interesting story!! Gives a whole new layer of meaning to the pop song about Pablo Picasso. I always thought the song was allegorical, the songwriter had someone else in mind and was using the name "Pablo Picasso" as a euphemism. But what do I know?

Lutz,

You can never be sure ...something is always hidden I have found as I get old and cynical. Also, truth is very subjective

Brian brought up Picasso's idea of "eliminate the unnecessary". That's my theme exactly. Got to have cohesion in sculpture, painting and photography. Get rid of anything which does not enhance the work! Most art I see is full of unnecessary crap. It fails as a result. No one wants or likes it.

Picasso worked mostly with symbolism as language. He was smarter than any of his contemporaries because he could really insult the establishment to the point that they loved him for it(because they needed the slapping down). he sucked up to no one and chose communism as his religion.

Denise: "Lutz,
You can never be sure ...something is always hidden I have found as I get old and cynical. Also, truth is very subjective."

Well Denise, to make things un-hidden is a process, a goal for the researcher/artist, not a fixed point. And as long as truth-finding is a human adventure we cannot exclude the researcher from the research nor their findings. Not in scientific research either. This holds even for younger and less cynical persons, haha...

Art is art. It is an artifice. Something created. It is neither a lie or the truth. It simply exists. It is liked or not liked. That's my two bob's worth!
Cheers.

It simply exists? How? Oh, it is something created... so it came into existence somehow... in this case thanks to Picasso, painting illusions, unless you regard the canvas containing a surface of paint the creation. In case you do, I agree, it is the same as a chair, a nail or a footstep in the sand.

I think the word lie is used for dramatic effect - it refers to something unreal, or even irreal,
yet it gives rise to a very real (true) response in the auditor/reader/spectator/viewer.

The artistic artefact is as insubstantial as a page, or just a line of poetry. Yet it can change
worlds... as Shelley said, poets are the unacknowledged legislators of the world!

Yes Lutz I meant visual art as in painting in as much that it is an arrangement of pigments on a canvas depicting a subject, regardless of style. Or music too would be arrangement, or pattern/s, of sound regardless of the complexity of those patterns of sound.
Cheers.

Art is magic... we are the magicians.

Some have magic.
Others have tricks.
Few have both.

A simple transformation spell, which even beginners can learn.
Three lines. One dot. Abracadabra. A face appears!
(-;

Point of order - communism isn't a religion. Its a political system.

"Many believe that Cubism was the direct result of Picasso’s use of opium, morphine, and hashish, though this is still up for debate."

"Picasso’s Cubist works were not the only ones seemingly influenced by his drug use, as his use of opium and hashish may have affected his vision significantly. Some believe that his Rose Period was also profoundly affected by his penchant for psychotropic drugs."

Edward, what do you mean?

Can't you chose anything as your religion? Art, sex, boose, fitness...? I always thought that English is a language with many expressions, not?

Stephen, there are rumors that his blue period was a result of taking the blue pill. You find the hints in the movie "Matrix".

Wikipedia:
The red pill and its opposite, the blue pill, are popular culture symbols representing the choice between embracing the sometimes painful truth of reality (red pill) and the blissful ignorance of illusion (blue pill). Redpills are people who have chosen to face reality, while bluepills remain living in ignorance of the truth, whether by choice or because they have not had a choice.

The terms, popularized in science fiction culture, are derived from the 1999 film The Matrix. In the film, the main character Neo is offered the choice between a red pill and a blue pill. The blue pill would allow him to remain in the fabricated reality of the Matrix, therefore living the "ignorance of illusion", while the red pill would lead to his escape from the Matrix and into the real world, therefore living the "truth of reality" even though it is a harsher, more difficult life.