Limited Time Promo Idea I Am Floating

Let us know how that works for you. My experience is that folks don't buy reduced art from this site and that the LTPs are hard to find unless they hyave been sent out via social media.

I did send out via Social Media - that was my point. I don't expect other artists to buy my art (I could only wish - hahaha). If this one works on Facebook, etc., then I will try again. If not ... well, my gallery wall is still selling. :)

Give it a go! Let us know. I try all kinds of sales....I Facebook them...Blog them....Mass email them....it's like pulling teeth. But every time I increase my prices, I sell more. Go figure.

I tried a couple of couple of these, didn't work for me, but it could have been bad timing. I tried at a time when sales were down for everyone so maybe just nobody was buying then. Good luck, I hope you do well, and it really is a great deal.

limited promo's done different ways, no sales. further as you mark up your price, faa takes a larger cut as well. i don't remember it doing that.

---Mike Savad
MikeSavad.com

Absolutely think you have the right idea to get images on the board with sales - even if you make next to nothing on the first sales. Because a sale trumps every other metric in terms of search placement, I think this is worth it over the long haul.

Another thought I had in the same vein is to offer single greeting cards with essentially no markup to encourage initial sales of images here and there and give those images a cheap and easy leg up in the search. As I would only make a couple of bucks with 'regular' pricing on the cards anyway, my 'cost' is really nothing.

Similarly, I'm thinking about do the same with some of the merchandise stuff where it's only feasible to make a buck or 5 in markup on the item.

The question is: Is a sale at any discount to improve visibility worth that improved visibility over the long haul?

This assumes all sales are created equal - i.e. a greeting card sale = a monster print sale, etc - in terms of effecting search placement...dunno on this but I 'think' a sale is a sale is a sale where FAA is concerned. If anyone can confirm..it would be much appreciated.

Only works if you have people on the fence. People either want the work or they don't. It's rarely about price.

Some competitor site sends me daily "last chance to get 40% off" emails. The only time I'd take advantage of that would be when I was ready to purchase something and I'd say "of thanks, I was just about to pay full price but why not".

.....

Shawn - This might answer your question - I have nearly 300 sales but only a few have been repeat sales of the same image. So would giving away those items at a low cost make sense if there were only a few potential buyers who want that image?

i've never had anyone to date - buy a small thing as a sample just to get the larger one down the road. the best you'll have is low profit and cards that are framed.

right now sales are slow because its summer. and chances are, even with a sale, you may not get the sale because there isn't anyone to see it.

---Mike Savad
MikeSavad.com

Hi Edward - "I have nearly 300 sales but only a few have been repeat sales of the same image. So would giving away those items at a low cost make sense if there were only a few potential buyers who want that image?"

Of my 70 FAA sales - 35 are from images that have sold more than once - meaning I've sold 35 images once and another 12 images for a total of 35 times (the single most image has sold 7 times). To me, that gives some credence to the correlation of sales to increased visibility. So, to me, it seems like there may be value (in increased visibility on FAA) from making low markup sales that would only net me a couple of bucks anyway (pillows, single cards, totes, etc.). The hope is that I'm supplying a port with wide enough appeal and that the key is just to get images seen (by right buyer at right time at right price point etc, etc.)...Just 'cause of the way the FAA search is setup - seems like making sales is what its all its about. Once you have increased visibility for an image, and potentially your port as a whole, you have better ability to make the sales that matter financially - the larger print sales.

I can legitimately charge a healthy markup on medium to large prints, but nobody's going to pay a similar markup for a tote or shower curtain - those sales are kind of meaningless in a direct bottom-line sense, BUT IF those small profit sales enhance visibility, they are worthwhile in that respect only.

So, I'm definitely not talking about discounting prints - my goal is to make larger print sales with healthy markups. It's all these other merchandise items where I can only make a couple of bucks anyway that I'm considering in terms of low markup sales - just to add to my visibility on FAA.

Hi Mike - I hear ya - I'm not looking to make repeat buyers from low markup items. The thought is simply that the sale itself (in FAA's secret sauce for promoting sellers) is the important thing. For sure, every sale helps promote an image above all others without a sale. And, maybe, there is an aggregate boost to the seller's portfolio as a whole based on overall sales (not so sure about this one, but it would make sense to me).

I used to charge $7 markup for a single card just to make it somewhat similar to a small print in price. Right now, I don't offer single cards at all. But, I don't like that it shows card pricing as $0.00 either. So, I think I'll just put a low markup on cards and other similar low profit merchandise (again, not talking prints), just to make them available for sales in order to possibly increase visibility.

With all this merchandise stuff, it seems like I have two choices: 1) not offer them at all, because they do not make me any money even when sold, or 2) offer them with the industry standard low markups in the hopes that any sales derived ultimately help promote my port with the goal of making higher markup (meaningful) large print sales - not necessarily from the same buyers. Right now I'm leaning towards option 2.

Or am i just missing the fact that people are buying $100 shower curtains?

People ARE buying shower curtains on FAA......I've sold a handful already. :)

A common scenario,

An artist starting out with low prices gets gallery representation. No sales for a long time. Work is on a par with others better known with higher pricing but still no sales. Artist gets fed up and doubles their prices. Starts selling. I've seen it many times having worked in galleries for the past 45+ years. You need to value yourself your work before others will.

Hopefully you are able to be objective in your self assessment. Big egos get tripped up too.

I had an interior designer contact me about a large gallery wrap and asked how much I discounted.

I told her I don't give discounts.

She ordered it.

I think most people are like me: if I like something, I like it, I buy it, end of story.

If it's a can of beans, I look for the cheapest price.

Right Sharon, but are they paying $100 for a shower curtain? God bless them if they are!

FAA's base price for a shower curtain is $60 and FAA suggests we markup only $2.50 to $5 per curtain to stay somewhat competitive in total price. For me, it does not make sense to worry about a $2 to $5 markup item when the goal is to make far more significant sales of prints.

But my point is that if the sale itself of a shower curtain enhances my image or port's visibility, then the sale itself has a longer term value with the goal of selling prints (not $2 markup merchandise items).

My questions being: are all sales equal in the eyes of the FAA secret search engine sauce and do overall sales enhance a seller's visibility as a whole? If the answers are yes, then it makes sense to bother with all these merchandise items. If the answer is no, then I do not really see the point in selling them (unless people really are paying $100 for a shower curtain). At a $5 markup, I'd have to sell dozens of $65 shower curtains to equal what I earn from the sale of 1 large print. Seems a little out of proportion.

Thanks Sharon - I upped my shower curtain prices.

Right Chuck, but aren't shower curtains and tote bags, etc. cans of beans in essence?

Again, I'm not talking about discounting prints - selling prints is why I'm here...not so sure about the other stuff. Seems like apples and oranges.

i've given discounts, and they give some sad story that the shipping is too much. or something like that.

---Mike Savad
MikeSavad.com

It could be a can of beans if its a common image or the buyers doesn't care that much.

Or it could be the only thing in the world they love.

the problem with the other things - we can't compete with other places. the bases prices for these are more than the other stores. i stuck a price in for some that i'll probably never get. i don't want to promote those things i won't get good money on. if i get a sale on those then fine.

i think everything but the cards moves you up. and partly i think its how much money you make, but that's impossible to verify. i think that, because people can mark things for very little and maybe get lots of sales and move up. which would work the engine.

i don't know the right price for a shower curtain, its marked at $90 - a really high price for what it is, $12 at amazon, $100 for cotton. other sites $45-60 - i can't compete with that. and its not really an invite either because other stores that have them, have a lot more. and those looking for curtains, aren't looking for posters, so i wouldn't necessarily get more sales from them. i've sold a few pillows and a few duvets, but haven't seen an increase in posters, a decrease actually. but that may be the timing of the summer.

---Mike Savad
MikeSavad.com

I am not experiencing slow sales for the summer. Quite the opposite in fact. I am on a trend line for one of, if not my best month on FAA and on my largest eBay store. Total different product mix which suggests a strength in the market not a weakness, imho. 8 of the remaining 10 stores are just about right on average. I do have two stores that are lagging. But they are the ones that I no longer promote and have been stripping product out of as items sell out.

I have been experimenting with a couple of other ideas on FAA that included opening up additional accounts. I have run several Limited Time Promotions on all of these accounts over and over again and I have never sold even one Limited Time Promotion.

I have finally given up on them all together. Time is better spent on other things.

Edward - that's kinda like saying you *could* try and charge an outrageous amount for a can of beans because that is what someone *may* absolutely want for some reason. Anything is possible, but unlikely, and just a waste of time for most people. And, at worse, it dilutes the legitimacy of selling what was otherwise branded as 'fine art' on 'fine art america'.

But, in the end, if those sales happen, add to my visibility and help create real print sales, then I'll do it. If that's the system, then I have to play by those rules. Confirmation is the hard thing to come by.

Shawn, we're not selling cans of beans... IF our artwork is artwork and not some photograph of the Eiffel Tower that anyone can take.

If ones art is unique, then it is one-of-a-kind and therefore commands a price that makes you want to create more.

"If ones art is unique, then it is one-of-a-kind and therefore commands a price that makes you want to create more."

This is where I have a problem with the "one-of-a-kind or "we are selling artwork". There is no such thing as a one of a kind print. It may be a one of a kind image, but the fact is, they are mass produced. They are not even limited edition. And you can even buy most of the same images on tote bags etc. I have a hard time with the "art" aspect once you get past the original and go into mass production. I think at that point, they have become mass produced consumer items.

Couple that with the fact that if the same image is in one of the licensing programs, that image can very likely end up on thousands of other items.

Shawn, I think your idea sounds like a good one in theory, but even if you put zero in the price, which means it will sell for no profit to you, I don't think you will sell enough to get much movement in the search. I could be wrong.

"and partly i think its how much money you make,"

Considering that FAA makes the same if the artist makes $5 on a sale or $500, would it not behoove Sean to move the guy up according to the number of sales he makes vs amount of money he is making?

That would think that would be the logical way of doing it and maximizing profits for FAA. But I really don't know either. Just guessing.

Getting back to the topic: Limited Time Promo Idea

For 10 years I tried all sorts of selling tricks and ideas on Craig's list.

At times, prints would he hundreds of dollars, other times they would be $29.

Mostly, I can say, nothing worked, except when a person really liked one of my images.

Then they bought large versions, paying full price for them. Here are a couple that originated from Craig's List:



Each time, it was about the artwork, not about the price.

Anyway, John, please let us know how it goes, and I wish you luck!

Chuck - agreed, if we're selling prints, gallery wraps, etc. at real valuations - we're selling art - albeit as Floyd points out - mass-producable art. That's what I've said all along. Hell, people's work does not even have to be unique to be sellable as art. There are plenty Eiffel Tower pics generating valuable returns. At this level, it will always be about getting the right piece in front of the right buyer at the right time at the right price - regardless of any perceived notions of uniqueness.

But when you slap that work on a tote, shower curtain, pillow, etc. for just a couple of bucks profit - some would argue you've left the realm of fine art and entered a world of beans. In fact, i bet Bush's has a higher margin on a can of beans than $2.

If you slap the Mona Lisa on a mug or whatever and sell it for $5, is that finished product still fine art? I vote no. Some may think it's better than sliced bread and if you sell a thousand of them you might be profitable.

So what i'm saying is that when I joined this site, it sold art - not beans. Recently, it's has started gravitating towards the addition of selling beans in the form of slap-on merchandise. I'm sure these slap-ons make sense for FAA financially, but do they make sense for the individual seller whose been asked to sell for a couple of bucks profit through FAA's pricing recommendations and presumed market analysis.

Getting back to the original post referencing discounts, the question is how valuable is a sale, any sale, in terms of enhancing a sellers visibility...probably not an answerable question by us sellers. But, we can and do see cause and effect relationships. Its nice to hear other people's perceptions on the subject b/c it's so fundamental to working with this site.

Floyd - I hear ya - it's not that I think that I'll sell a lot of these low profit items - I'm just wondering how valuable a sale is in terms visibility within FAA. If I'm not going to make any money on them anyway if they do sell, I'm wondering what the residual value of the sale might be. And, I think your dead on with your other thoughts above.

the site makes a percentage off of your profit, so they are making more than you think.

if you sell a 100 cards and the site makes a buck - you shouldn't advance as much as the person who sold a 100 posters. but on top of that they do tack on another 10% or so


---Mike Savad
MikeSavad.com

You got a point Shawn, your idea will actually cost less than PayPerClick or FB/Twitter boost.

For myself, I simple do not ever expect, nor do I care that much if I ever sell, a tote, pillow, shower curtain, cell phone cover or a duvet. If I do, fine, it is plus money. But it is not much money.

I sell product here every day and of all of the totes, cell phone covers and pillows I have sold, combined, they are not 8% of my total number of sales. Just for the record, I have sold phone covers, pillows and totes, no duvets or shower curtains.

I am not looking for nickel dime items to sell. I think it is great that Sean has made deals to allow us to sell them and I am opted in to all of them but they are never, imho, going to be a, main profit center for me. Same thing with the new retail store partnership. It is a great program for FAA and I am in. But I doubt it is going to add more then maybe a few percentages points to my gross number of sales, if that much, on a yearly bases.

I do not promote phone covers, totes, pillows, etc, etc. And I for sure am not going to advertise for the retail store partnership. Why would advertise for someone else to sell the same print for half the money? The idea to me is THEY find the customers that I would not otherwise have access to. That is why they are getting their 50%. Why would I want to do that? There is simply not enough markup in them when I have much higher profit items to sell.

Not sure how much or how they figure out what they want to tack on to what. But the lower the artist's commission is the lower the over all price is going to be and FAA can still tack on all they want. But again, we will probably never know the answer to this.

I am currently trying this one:

Have you been jonesing for a LUXURY art print on Gallery Wrapped Canvas by me, but cannot stomach the high price tag? Right now I can get you 40 to 50% off of retail price on many of my prints on Gallery Wrapped Canvas! That's 40 to 50% of the total price! The super long pieces do not work for this promotion, but MANY in my portfolio qualify. Just tell me which piece you want and I will tell you what sizes you can get for the SUPER LOW PRICES! Hurry!! This offer is limited to only a few days. ‪#‎art‬ This is just a small sample of my work. See them ALL here:

-------------------

One bite so far on Facebook. I think I will try it on my blog too.

So far, not a single bite. I'm gonna let this promo run its course, then I am raising prices for a month or two and see if that increases sales as some seem to indicate.

It is all fun; I take nothing, including myself, so seriously as to cause worry or anxiety. Life is good.

Well said, John. My feelings as well.

Sharon, that will probably work out for you and get you a few sales. I hope so.

But I have taken the Trader Joe's route:

When you shop at Trader Joe's, you don't have to scan the ads to see what's on sale, because they don't have sales.

When I shop at other markets, once they have announced how low they will go on a product, I won't buy that product until it is on sale again.

(I wish I could say that about gasoline, but unfortunately it doesn't work that way. But I do combine trips and drive less when the gas prices are at their highest.)

My feelings are that I am in for the long haul and it may take years for some fans to actually purchase, but in time, they can't resist and will buy.

If they see me cutting prices and trying gimmicks, I feel they will lose confidence in me.

When "testing" a sale, be sure to keep the sampling pure. In the end you want to be able to trace it back to the source. For example use one coupon code for FB, a different one for Twitter, a different one for your blog etc.

...

@Chuck - Yeah like Joanne Fabrics. I wouldn't think of shopping there without a coupon. They jack up the prices so that their daily/weekly coupons seem like a good deal.

Basically they've made their coupon marketing something buyers expect.

A better method would be to have a twice a year sale. So people know that if they really want a deal they will have to wait six months for it.

I go back and delete sales notices once I am done. Social Media is so "fleeting".....Having sales has NEVER hurt me for repeat buyers. I have buyers that pay full price and then jump on sales and then pay full price later. So I go with the "anything goes" model....LOL

Nicely stated, John: "It is all fun; I take nothing, including myself, so seriously as to cause worry or anxiety. Life is good."

Exactly my outlook. On another (business) forum where I have been active for over 10 years my sig reads, "If you are too busy to laugh you are too busy."



---------------
~ Bill
~ US Pictures .com

Edward, re: Joanne Fabrics...

I knew people at work who waited for six months, or was it a year?-- for the Barney's Warehouse Sales.

Then they would go and spend a thousand dollars and more for clothes.

Years later, it turns out that someone hiring for the sales called me and I said, "Why not? Something different."

So I worked the sales a few days. Truthfully, I believe most of the items sold had never seen a Barney's New York.

They were cheap products made expressly for the sale.

Just to add a note about greed and "getting a deal" mentality.

These high fashion business execs from Century City and Beverly Hills would come in wearing their suits and ties and find items they liked.

Since there were no dressing rooms, they would strip down to their underwear, right their in public view, to try on pants and things.

It was really something to see!

In Boston there used to be the crazy Filenes Basement Wedding dress one day sale. Brides would rip dresses out of the hands of others, no dressing rooms, grab piles etc.

Nice thing about PODs is We Can Always Make More!

I'm trying a few coupon codes on specific images. We'll see what happens. The problem is when most people in your circle are not buyers, just other sellers.

I agree pretty much with you Chuck, I don't believe mauch in sales for selling art. Sales are great for everyday items where there is an on going need and several sources for people to fill that need.

But I just don't think that the best "sale" gimmick in the world can crate a need where one does not exist. In my opinion, all it does is give the people that are currently shopping for art, which is not an ongoing need, a chance to pay less for what they would normally pay full price for anyway.

It is not like shopping for a can of Bush Beans where everyone is selling the same exact thing or a new car where there are standardized prices that one can compare the "sale" price to. Art is unique and there are no standardized prices. If the buyers does not like the piece they simply will not buy the art at any price as a general rule.

Edward: "The problem is when most people in your circle are not buyers, just other sellers."

That's why I have dropped over 3,000 individuals and companies I was following on Twitter.

I now follow less than 400, but have over 4,000 followers.

I seek out the people and brands that may potentially buy my books, or artwork, or use my special effects lens.

Correct, Floyd: "If the buyers does not like the piece they simply will not buy the art at any price as a general rule."

John,

I have only one small experience discounting here. I used the pre sized canvasses promotion. I left it running for some weeks.

Nada.

Perhaps some people know where to shop for the pre sized canvasses. Still no takers.

It has nothing to do with the images. It has to do with when people need art they budget, but they do not bargain hunt. Or
they run to TJ Max for decor. Just my take.....after reading this interesting thread I am sticking to my take.

Dave

I keep promoting a LTP here and there and think I have sold one or two. My greatest hope was of a railroad scene never to be repeated again because the railroad is about to be gone. People love to tell me how great the shot is... but no sales yet.

never sold an LTP...but I keep them active (for the most part, aside from when I forget to renew every 5th day - like now)...mainly b/c I've seen them show up in google image searches. I'm always for low/no cost ways to promote visibility, and LTP seems like one small way. Wish you could do more - maybe 5 or 7 at a time just b/c they do seem to get picked up by Google. Even though I have not had an LTP sale directly, I have had regular print sales of the LTP images. B/c you can only offer one specific canvas size in a LTP, maybe a buyer or two has seen an image through that program and decided to buy a regular print or metal, etc at a different size. No way to really tell. But, there really is no time cost to keep the LTP active, so may as well do it, imo.

One note on the LTP...I always use images that have sold as they are ranked higher than others that have not sold...multiple sales show up the best...just like in regular searches. I have one file that has sold seven times and is usually on the 2 to 4th page of LTPs.

The one that really surprises me is how many people that run huge discount sales during the holidays.

I never ran sales during the holidays on art or custom framing. Never. It was the one time of years where we could litterly sell every single hour for all of out framers for full price and then a lot more hours. I even had my wife down there framing and I actually did a bunch of work myself! We opened early and closed late and went 7 days a week and still had a hard time to get everything done for Christmas.

Why would I want to discount that.

That included the art in the gallery.

That is the one time of year where people "HAVE" spend money and they will very often pay what ever they had to to get someone crossed off their shopping list.

We were selling art. Not the the latest high tech gizmo or Cabbage Patch Doll that they could find in 25 different stores and shop for price.

I do the same thing online. I do not have sales for the holidays. Never.

This promo runs through Sunday - no sales yet - not even a question from anyone. HA!

Yessiree, this is a fun experiment. :)

Had a "nuclear" stress test for my heart today (third heart test in 3 weeks) but I feel awesome. Headed out again with two cameras, lots of water, and some "extras" for experimenting (mirrors, glass globe "crystal ball," and a couple other goodies. Tomorrow will be Saturday as usual - creating art from my Friday shoots.

Y'all be good now! If you can't be good, at least be careful.

I had zero sales and not even a query. Won't try this again. It was a good experiment.

I am posting from my Samsung tablet because my PC is in the repair shop. I tried updating to Windows 10 and it destroyed my windows 8.1 after failing to install 10. It is taking a week to recover all the data. Grrrrrr.

Thanks for coming back with an update John, it is good to hear the results though I am sorry you didn't get a sale. Sorry about your computer too :-(