Making Art With A Market.....

Excellent, I have been thinking of this exact thing, I live in Utah, a beautiful state, and every one photographs it!! So now I am on a quest for subject matter that matters, but is low on the photo list, I know it's not swans!

TL Mair
tlmair.com

People spend all kinds of money traveling to other parts of the world only to take the same photographs every other tourist is taking. What about your own area? Most likely its under-served.

Mature subjects - flowers, birds, Eiffel Tower, NYC skyline etc are still immensely popular but you better bring something new to the table if you want to stand out.

Then there are subjects that no one wants - ever - like photographs of your feet.

You are selling a memory, a feeling, not "I saw x". The photographs with power have more to them then just documenting a physical object.

Great post Thomas! Very well thought out. Thanks for sharing your thoughts on the matter.

@Edward I guess I better just format that 16 gig card I just filled up with photos of my feet. Damn! I thought I was on to something.

Great thread, Thomas. Thanks for posting.

Kathy K. McClellan
http://keppenart.com

yes, the message is clear. with little modification 'if the motive is not only money' do art/ photography which give you peace/ bliss/ fun...after all values differ for different people

The message is about posting artwork in a store such as FAA. There are plenty of places to share art/photography for fun - Facebook, Flickr, etc. When you put a price on your work and offer it for sale there is a different level of expectations.

The book has already been written Thomas. " Sell and ReSell your Photos" by Rohn Engh. Check it out at your library. I've been doing this since 1992. ...

... I like the passion you put into your writing. Good reminder of some things I forgot about.

Well stated, Thomas.
I have one series that has a targeted market and does quite well as prints and original paintings. I formed a company and promote the fine art reproductions of the series. Most of my buyers find me via google search and faa's ranking is quite high.
I am presently targeting another market and will let you know how that goes!
Frank, thanks for the book title.

Your flower example is how I believe the landscape painting market is unfortunately, there is high demand but it's also over-served. I have no idea what to do about that.

Marlene -- My pleasure. Enjoy your day.

Excellent post, Thomas, thanks! I can't help it though, I still love to photograph flowers.

And Peggy that is great, I'm not saying to not photograph flowers.

I am simply stating that if making money is part of your goal with your art, your time would be better spent photographing other things.....for instance a great niche market you have carved out like chipmunks and squirrels having cocktails!

Thomas, are they drinking Cosmopolitans or dirty martinis?

I don't know, my knowledge of drinks goes from beer, to bourbon, with a little tequila in there somewhere. Those 3 get me snookered just fine!

VERY good post, thanks....

David King....if I was painting, I would do the same thing I do with my photography. Find subjects that have a defined market, but also aren't heavily saturated....then focus on making the best quality art for that market that you can. Rinse....reuse...repeat!

Problem is Thomas, I have no idea what that would be, the whole market seems pretty darn saturated to me. I guess I'm not creative enough to come up with an underserved niche.

With painting you have the advantage of sticking out with a style.

Few photographers have a style which sets them apart.

Oh oh oh oh OH..... I can use this thread to justify buying even more Emerson Knives because now I can shoot them and sell the pictures and will be making money!!!!!!!!!!!!!

(Fits both 4 and 5)

Instead of selfies....call em knifeies?

Knife porn is the official term used by aficionados.

JC, I say take a stab at it!

::::::ducking::::::

I was telling my girlfriend about not bothering trying to sell flowers (she sells prints too)... She then proceeded to sell 5 pictures of a sunflower lol.

I've done OK throughout the 4 decades selling my art to what I consider a both unique and diverse market.

People who buy their first piece in spite of themselves.

For they never expected to ever buy a "Rat, Bat, Vulture Sculptures, when they initially come upon my work.

The first question they have (usually to themselves) Why the hell are they here?..Especially, at this prestigious venue

Everything about them is wrong:

......Who wants a Rat, Bat or Vulture Sculpture?

......They certainly are not "Museum Quality"

.......And....SHELLCRAFT!! HOW LOW CAN ONE GO??

But enough do buy

And the one sure thing about this market is that I can never predict who'll buy and who won't

For they come from all areas of society

Go Figure

Marlene Burns

"JC, I say take a stab at it! "

Marlene, You are so SHARP! :-)

Bill Tomsa

http://billtomsa.blogspot.com/

You forgot Zombie Hummingbirds.

I did not forget. I remembered YOU specifically, thinking that you already had that market sewed up (i.e., well served).

But zombie killing implements might be a way to go too, J.C.

Maybe when we get our fill of the walking dead, we can get back to really living again. But I guess life is boring, and death is so much more exciting. Humans are strange that way.

I submit that a pocket knife is not a suitable zombie stopper. You have to smash the head, or decapitate the zombie to bring it to a full stop. I would think that a really sharp Japanese samurai sword or a broadsword might be most effective. You want something with good reach, to avoid getting bitten. With Zombie hummingbirds, you mainly need a full helmet, such as a motorcyclist or fighter pilot would wear, since he's going for ears, eyes, or nose. JC is well equipped. JC's airplane photos are a good example of a specialty niche with a good strong market, too.

Did you say making art with a marker.. oh.. no sorry..I misread. making art with a market.. now that is a very long subject.. but I added art made with a marker.. felt tip marker to be exact.. anyway have a nice day .. wow.. let me know when this discussion closes as you would have written a very very very long book.. that is a very hard thing to decide just what sells.. and it is discussed here pretty much on a regular basis yet it is like the secrets of the universe.. no one really knows.. JGP

@Jean ...You are selling a memory, a feeling.....any Worlds :)

you really know it http://fineartamerica.com/contests/digital-desire-loving-glances.html?tab=artwork

- most expensive is your image :) it is like the secrets of the universe..

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Or, if you are not have - join ! World Makers Virtual Photography and meet some of the people creating and doing amazing things
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Create your avatar and chat in 3D. It's free.
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I just wanted to remind everyone that voting for Yellow Yellow Yellow

Contest Overview 471 Members 861 Pieces of Artwork 0 Discussions 357 Votes
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Congratulations Contest Administrator Christina Stanley


Thanks you all for the great thread.
Good Luck ! V

Vale

Please take some time off for spamming.

This is NOT the place to post links that have nothing to do with the thread.

On topic, there are myriad Abilenes that still remain.

I shot a local landmark a couple months back. The landmark is in a city with a metro population of 1.12 million people yet there are only eight images her of the landmark. Two are mine. Sold one yesterday.....

Ejection seat activated. SPROINGGGGGG!

...

My last sale had 100 repins. Its a good gauge of popularity.

.....I sent a John Deere print to Hong Kong of all places yesterday. Who knew!

STAFF MESSAGE ~ THIS POST REMOVED BECAUSE OF GRATUITOUS NUDITY AND SPAM

Great post and interesting thread.....enjoyed the humour btw! :-)

This thread kind of relates to something I've been thinking about. I am currently living in Australia and the beaches and so many other things are great to photograph, but when I label beach scenes, windsurfing photos, etc. with their location in Australia, I wonder if I'm turning off some customers who think, well, I'll never go to Australia and I'm not really interested in a beach in Australia. I don't ever see anyone from Australia looking at my work. Maybe I'd be better off posting these pictures as a generic beach. I just wonder sometimes....

I don't think posting a place as a location just because you are there is good, I think it should be a recognizable place to post the location, aka someone from there would look at the photo and know exactly where you are.

But at the same time without the location you are awash in a sea of nameless beach photos.

Double edged sword.

Great post, especially the parts about being different. However, if you say photograph a flower that is quite different than anything else, how do you get people to see it. Your photo may be buried on page 35 of 50 pages of search results. I for one, probably won't sift through 35 pages before I find something I like. Like the local photo idea as maybe the best chance to be under-saturated in the market, BUT your market may be solely local aka small.

Kind of a tangent to this topic. What about model and property releases? I'm sure many don't bother, but that doesn't make it legal, if someone comes after you. For example, I recently shot a photo of the Tampa nighttime skyline that many people loved. However, most of the buildings have business logos. Even if I remove the logos, they are pretty recognizable. Any LEGAL resources or documents on releases? Your opinions will be great, but can you back them up with a legal resource?

@lanis, you can't rely on the internal search, you have to seek people out. look up people who live that specific flower.

you don't need model releases and such for art. for commercial yes, but not for art. you are free to shoot people on the street etc, all you want. its not a bad idea to have a release if you can get one. building logos are trademarks - but only if they fight them. if there are a number of them, i don't think there would be an issue because you didn't single out one single buildings. and you don't need a building permission because you can shoot those. if you were an architect trying to copy the building, that would be a different story.

every location you shoot in may have different laws about that btw.


---Mike Savad
MikeSavad.com

There is no such thing as a model release or property release in art photography.

@Thomas, to put a finer point on this, doesn't that really only apply to prints? I have come under the impression lately that if you are putting your images on mouse pads, coffee cups, cell phone covers, etc, that it was at that point actually considered commercial because it was being used to sell an item.

(standard disclaimer: not a lawyer and don't play one on TV)

I have a question along this line. Are photographs of sculptures legal? I have one I'd like to post. It's from a museum in Tulsa, and it looks old and chipped, but I have no idea who did it. I'd love to post the photograph but don't know the ethics or legality.

The release issue kind of hijacked this thread, so I started a new one. I posted 3 links on the subject, including from an attorney. Hope it helps.

Model And Property Releases
http://fineartamerica.com/showmessages.php?messageid=2478460

It's true locations that are not oversaturated sell. I don't sell that much here, but about 50 percent of what I have sold is local stuff that never (or rather rarely) gets shot. The shoreline of Lake Huron, the Saint Clair river that runs up the eastern side of Michigan between the US and Canada. I'm told by the lady at the art association store downtown, people buy photos of freighters also. I live in "freighter central", so to speak. They go by every day. The only problem is I hate photographing freighters. Oh well, I have a few that came out ok. No sales of those yet, though.

HW yes.....the whole putting the image on products takes it into a very grey area that I don't really like to be in.

I have a theory that if you can easily ffill a unique niche in a search engine, you should consider doing so.
I was doing some experimentation in photoshop, and chose the copyright symbol as a subject, provoked to do so by one of the many copyright discussions on the discussions here. What the heck, I posted it, and to my surprise, someone quickly ordered a large canvas print. I speculate it was an intellectual property lawyer, since the customer contacted me and also requested a similar image with the trademark symbol.

If you do a Google image search on "copyright character", mine was one of the very few artistic images that showed up.
Showing up on the first page of a Google image search can be very, very good.

Perfect example Gregory, thanks for sharing!

Hi Thomas,
yeah no flowers definitely tired of those.
Janelle

Re-opened and bumped.

Great thread!