It's A Bourgeois World

Few understand it or almost feel sorry for you if you announce an artistic path.

Kevin,

No offensive, but Ronald has begun a thread earlier today on being strange.

I truly dont see any need for two threads on one topic.

But to respond, I am kind of insulted by being called bourgeois. You know
my art career is an all or nothing bet. This is not a down the yellow line sort of
fiasco.

So I think I need to just hold off on commenting on this thread.

Dave

Dave, yeah I saw Ron's post. He and I are pretty good friends and I think I am asking a different question, which is: people think you are "different" when you are an artist, but are we really just normal folks? After all many of us live in nice middle class homes, wear pretty much the same clothes as the rest of our peers in what ever country in which we reside, drive the same autos, go to church or golf on Sundays. Many also work at "real" jobs to support our bad habits of creating art.

Not sure why the term would be offensive Dave, you appear to be a very middle class type of guy. But if you do not feel you are, why? merely being an artist does not remove one from the middle class.

bour·geoi·sie
ˌbo͝orZHwäˈzē/
noun
noun: bourgeoisie; plural noun: bourgeoisies

the middle class, typically with reference to its perceived materialistic values or conventional attitudes.

Kevin,

I am not very serious. I am kidding. I am next to punch drunk. I will get a second wind later this evening.

Been up all night for good reason. Also got a new image done and uploaded for sale here.

I have been waiting this afternoon on an email that will probably be coming tomorrow at this rate.

I got to get off my butt and get out of this condo.

Just one note about bourgeoisie, they live on a cliff face with no real net to fall to if things go wrong. Medical
bills etc....Retirement plans are sparse etc......

Who really is boureoisie? They are one foot in the grave and one foot close to debtors prison. Lucky to do well beyond
the risks of being boureoisie.

Dave

"...people think you are "different" when you are an artist, but are we really just normal folks?..."


Yep, just "normal folks". I know people who have different vocations/occupations, which include military, school teachers, store owners, coal miners, etc. You know what? They're all just normal working class folks doing what they do to pay the bills and put food on the table.

No, this thread is not the same as Ron's "strange" thread. :)

Greg,

Nicely stated. It is raw deal for most economically.

Food on the table is not enough, but the rest is politics. So I will stop here.

Dave

"Why do you have to be so different??"...

A question my older sister has been continually asking me, since I can remember.

She is now 91 and I'm about to be 80...And she's still asking it.



I have to confess...., I enjoy being slightly off center

Yeah, Roger I too have used my artistic weirdness to my advantage. But the truth is I am not so weird...except when I am. I once saw a documentary on a man who lived in the doorway of the San Francisco Art Institute. Everyone thought he was just a strange homeless guy. A couple of the professors would buy him coffee and let him spend time on the roof of the building. One day he was found dead, under the overhang in the back of the school. When they opened his backpack they found magazines covered in his drawings. He was an art savant, a true artist who expected nothing from his art but the pleasure of creating.

Now that was a strange artist.

I think that the bougeoisies think that artists are somewhat bohemian in there lifestyles and that is why they look at us differently.
As far as they are concerned, you can look and act "normally" but in reality you must be a bohemian in disguise.

I was considered an oddity l-o-n-g before anyone considered me 'artistic'. Funny thing is, I've always considered it an unintentional compliment (odd, strange, weird, unusual . . . ), and feel a little sad for those who are burdened with the 'normal' or 'average' tags.

Imagine trying to maintain 'normalcy', on a day-to-day basis!

Ha, Wendy you make a good point.

"Bourgeois" - what's that? Me thinks someone should look up the definition.

Bohemian - that's what many folks, I think, think of "artistes". And sane adults generally throw up their hands when their offspring - say they are going to be artists - "go get a real job".

Kevin, I liked yours better, I closed mine.

I have a very conservative type of job, that of teaching in the public schools. I grew up in middle class america with my father being an aeronautical engineer and my mom being a school teacher. My work is about living in the suburbs, not much odd here!

Bourgeois means average, middle class, (It originally referred to property owners with no title, who were looked down upon by the titled rich and royals of the day).

I think everyone feels 'not normal' at least some of the time, and people who think they're 'normal' all the time are just wrong.

Wendy, you described me to a T. Except it took my a few years to grow into my real skin. I was brought up in a no-nonsense family, where "get a real job' was the mantra. It was also a home where there was a very critical air, and it took me a long time to stop struggling with guilt. As the oldest, I was supposed to set an example. But my siblings always did think me somewhat strange, and now I really don't care. I like me.

Rebecca

Generally I am level headed, so much so that I am frequently the one to set up exhibits and coordinate stuff between artist. This does not mean I never get upset or rattled in some fashion, it does happen from time to time. When I paint my brain seems to work in a very different fashion, my brain wanders away in ways I would not allow in my day to day existence. My father was highly concerned when he found out I intended to pursue art. He took me to work,(Naval Base) and dropped me off at the art department in hopes that I would at least take interest in commercial art. I did not, hated it in fact and vowed to only pursue "Fine" art. The compromise in my life was teaching art. A good gig except for the time factor. Blah Blah Blah, I will shut up now!

WOW that's a loaded question about being "normal" "artsy" is there such a thing as normal. It's all relative.

Artsy that is a bit easier to answer. I feel fine with being artsy for lack of a better word. I never fit in with corporate structure rules and dress code. I would not do well especially, having tasted the freedom of self employment, at this stage in my life, having to work in a corporate environment.

That does not make me abnormal. Maybe everyone else is abnormal :-) like I said it's relative. We think often normal is what everyone else does and society has carved in to stone. That is not a good thing. Normal stifles new ideas, normal lacks imagination, normal is such an overused irrelevant word. The fear of being out of the norm keep people in the prison of pretence, wearing masks and getting ulcers. I can't blame people though because, it takes lots of courage to break out of the perceived norms, society is not very kind to the misfits!

I can think of a few things millions of people do every day that many other people look at as abnormal. It's a loaded question.

Artists are normal.
It's everyone else that's abnormal.

I'm the odd ball in my family, and I'm absolutely fine with that. I have an older sister, too, @Roger. She's given up trying to encourage me to be "normal."

Note: This is not my artwork--just a cute image I saw online.

I don't think there is an overall normal person. Each person does things that are normal to them yet abnormal to others. It depends on philosophical differences. Nobody is totally normal or abnormal only behaviours are and in a way everyone is a little bit insane!

Great responses, thanks all. Like many of us, as "normal" as I want to be, I am not sometimes. The artist just breaks out. But really at the age of 62 (nearly) I live a pretty normal life. Nice house, nice neighborhood, long happy marriage, all the trappings of middle class. Except I have a studio and gallery in my home and we are all very artcentric.

I met up with an artist from here in Brooklyn. Since I had never met him I asked what he was wearing. His response? I look like an artist.

He did.

When you're a kid being different even in a good or gifted way is tough. You do want to be normal and fit in, but there is an apparent difference. You really do see the world with a different perspective and even your conversation and choices will surprise people. So it's really hard on a kid that wants nothing more than to be like everyone else, to be so obviously different. I really don't think this has to do with security and acceptance, as much as the expectation placed on kids to do something with their gift.

I use to go to some extremes to hide from my peers how I was 'different' (throw the game plays). But it was about resentment that more was expected than for anything else, not that I wanted everyone to think I was the same as them. I felt it was unfair that just because I was different, I had to be different. Took me a long time to figure out you do have to live with being different if that's the card you drew.
-- mary ellen anderson

Just the opposite here, Mary Ellen. I never wanted to fit in. As much as I hated being bullied and ostracized, I firmly believed those who taunted me (whether child or adult, and including some of my relatives) must be simple-minded. I definitely didn't want want to be that!

I was an early-reader, and it seemed that all the truly fascinating people in the world were outsiders, to one degree or another. I took great comfort in thinking I was one of them . . . and not one of the apparent-simpletons populating my everyday life.

Even during my years in corporate America, I learned that if I was great at my job, I could get away with being a weekend photographer who sang rock and roll by night, and wore glittery black nail polish in the boardroom!

The trick is to teach people it's okay that you're different. Those who refuse to learn, don't deserve your time and effort. Learning that, at an early age, was critical to my survival. Best lesson ever!

So in the late 70's I was working in a department store as a clerk in men's clothing while trying to line up a job to incorporate my graphic design skills and one of the other clerks and I were talking. When I told him I was a graphic artist he replied "Gee, you don't look like an artist." So now, at 67 I've been wearing my grey hair in a pony tail since I turned 60. Does it help me sell art? Damned if I know, but I do stand out in this pretty conservative part of Maine.

Bill Tomsa
http://billtomsa.blogspot.com/

Great stuff thank you all

Trying to post from phone keep getting doubles.

Oops

Now, why would anyone think I look like an artist?

Wendy, we're probably talking about different things. I'm not talking about wanting to fit in with the insecure bullies and idiots, but the actual burden of being 'gifted'. Especially among your family and people you do want to like you.

My first college calculus class they gave us the standard pop test on day one to see where everyone was. We walked in class the next day and the prof says everyone but one had done bad, indicating me and asked me to stay after class to talk. I'd gotten a 23/25 and the next high score was a 3. He told me that because I was so far ahead that I'd be on a different grading system A=100 B=99 C=98 D=97. (I'd failed the pop test). Well I thought this was pretty unfair, and the guy had made me hated by the class too. My solution at the time was to never go back to that class again.

Do you not ever feel the pinch of having to live up to expectations? Or had everything discounted as being easier for you? Or you should have known better or done better because your gifted? The sourness of beating your best friend in a competition, especially if it meant more to them than you?

Don't you ever wonder what it would be like to just be normal? Course kids always romanticize that the grass is greener; just as I was wrong that when I grew up no one would ever be able to tell me what to do, I'm sure my dream of the 'easy' life was wrong. Today I wonder how if can't be painful to be that dumb - lol.

-- mary ellen anderson

I'm the most abnormal person I've never met. But then, I'm not sure what normal is. And normal for what? I don't think I even sleep normal - I'm a morning person - been up since 5 now - my better half will get up at 7 or 8, sometimes depending on whether I call her while I'm out on my morning stroll of 7 miles, or not. (Too cold this morning for a Florida boy - it's 35º F). It took me a year or so to get used to her staying up until one in the morning - I finally gave up - and went to bed when I was sleepy. You want to 'fool around' you go to bed when I do - you can always get up and do whatever until you are ready to quietly slip under the sheets

Roger, you look like a Venetian gondolier. 😎

Mary Ellen and Wendy, growing up in a small farming community I always thought I was a bit different but also pretty normal. I played sports, worked, drank beer with the boys, etc. years after I left home all my friends from home would tell me "I always knew you would do well and be an artist," I just wish they would have told me then, it may have erased many doubts I had about myself.

Believe me I live a very happy life.

Speaking of Brooklyn, my son Brad has been in Bushwick for several years. The minute you meet him you will know he is an artist.

Kevin,
I think the difference is that artist's naturally choose who they want to be that day. Most of the time we choose to appear just as normal, but it's an act - lol.
-- mary ellen anderson

Sorry Colin but Roger looks more like a French onion seller.

Roger where can I get an outfit like that!?? Will you sell it to me? It would go so well with my grey ponytail! Also, I can grow my beard back and people will think we're twins....born 10 years apart. :-)

Bill Tomsa

http://billtomsa.blogspot.com/