People's Climate March ...

the march is on sunday 21st by the way. we're promised 82F so it will be nice and warm.

Greenpeace handed over a globe with 6,000,000 (6 million) drops of water in, one for each member of Greenpeace (myself included) who wants radical action taken yesterday for the planet

its interesting how thin our atmosphere really is.. scary thought

well done Greenpeace and i really like that Abbie. yes, very scary Melissa. i've found someone to accompany me now so that i won't be so scared of the crowds. :)

It's over and done. the rich and powerful, the poor and stupid want nothing to do with "climate salvation." This covers about 99 percent of the world's population. It's like green people saying let's not use plastic bags anymore.

I've listened to ocean scientists saying, "don't bother, the oceans are beyond help." This applies to the entire surface of the planet.

Just be thankful we have ours and can at least live till we die. Our children's children are in for some very interesting times. My one hope is that the ebola virus wipes out about 90 percent of the world's population. That would be a good start.

I honestly do not think I am a pessimist here. I am a realist. I've listened to scientists the world over who agree with me.

IN short, get yours while you can.

Yikes Robert.

The trajectory for the environment is truly horrible. But it can be changed if enough people insist on exactly that.

I'd love to join you Carolyn..but its a wee bit out my way :-) Have fun..try not get too arrested!



"My one hope is that the ebola virus wipes out about 90 percent of the world's population. That would be a good start. I honestly do not think I am a pessimist here. I am a realist."....

Robert...lol.. yeah there's nothing pessimistic about that statement....only 90%...? Still, this would provide plenty of spirits to photograph..really! ;-)

thanks, Barry. i'm a bit nervous about all those people but if its overwhelming, its not far for me to walk home. maybe we should make this a discussion topic for your group. i'll take my little camera with me. i don't think we should ever give up on anything but i am an optimist.

natural selection huh? kill everyone off with ebola.

RFG you'd get some amazing photographs if you were here. :)

Well - someone loves y'all - cause that is ONE day it will be in the 80's - maybe - then it begins to sink to the "normal' temperatures - again - http://www.accuweather.com/en/us/new-york-ny/10007/daily-weather-forecast/349727?day=3

The number ONE problem with People and the Earth is not climate - there ain't NOTHING we can do about it - it's controlled by the sun primarily - BUT - we are going to litter and poison ourselves to death, if some plague doesn't take us first. Saving the earth - no - saving humans - when human's don't really care. It's like it's against the law to drink and drive (usually the liquid of choice is beer) yet every gas fill-up place has the "coldest beer in town" - and you think those folks that buy COLD beer are going to wait to get home; it's amazing to me they then put the empty can's in the back of their pickups or bring them out to their vehicle so they can throw them onto the side of the roadways. We pay billions of dollars in litter control and even have laws and fines for people who litter - when the simplest solution would be to forbid take-out from fast food restaurants. Recycle - yes - we used to recycle - coke came in glass bottles, your food was served on washable dishes as was the silverware you ate it with and the glass or cup you drank your liquid from. I live on a street that is 5 blocks long, the city pays to have recycle pickup - today was the day - there are 3 folks in five blocks that put out recycle bins. the folks across the street - believe that it simply goes to the landfill anyway. I put it out - not because I really believe there is a 'grand' scheme to reuse it - but because it gives me two trash pickups a week - I simply have to sort it for them.

1)...the richest, most powerful societies in world history, like the United States and Canada, are racing full-speed ahead to destroy the environment as quickly as possible....you can't stop them...the rich are different than us...they have all the power....

2)... Energy independence... This means: we’ll have a century in which to maximize the use of fossil fuels and contribute to destroying the world.

3)...nuclear war. It’s been known for a long time that if there were to be a first strike by a major power, even with no retaliation, it would probably destroy civilization just because of the nuclear-winter consequences that would follow. You can read about it in the Bulletin of Atomic Scientists.

We are hanging over a cliff by our fingernails and they are slipping fast....

Oh, but wait if we all get together and Don't Use Straws we can End Needless Waste.......

I used to earn pocket money selling back the glass bottles to the off licence. Now they wont take them as health and safety tell them to use new bottles

"I’d mention the record ice pack and how climate change gives the PowersThatBe an excuse to impose a global tax system which in turn funds the New World Order, but that would be rude and no one wants to hear that kind of talk."

Not on the main forum, at any rate ;)

Bring it over to the open group Roy..there's plenty of hot debate going on there re that very topic...(which I happen to agree with 100%) http://fineartamerica.com/groups/everything-in-moderation-including-moderation.html

I'm an optimist, too, Carolyn. There is so much negativity in the other threads that I'll stay here. I realize that the world's climate is always changing -- that is obvious. But the least we can do as humans is reduce our destruction of the environment. Humans don't deserve to live on this planet if we are destroying it. The question is, how best to go about remedying that. Awareness is always a first step, and it sounds like the march had a good turnout.

almost 400,000 Patricia. a little unnerving. i tucked in with some japanese monks because i was frightened (i dont' like crowds). there were some great floats and bands and presentations. and you're right, we don't deserve our planet if we keep treating it so badly.

Photography, here in new york they crunch up the glass and recycle it by putting it into the roads. that's why our roads sparkle and twinkle. :)

"...there were some great floats ..."


Sorry, but just have to throw this question in: Were the floats being pulled by vehicles / tractors that operate using internal combustion engines? Just a thought.

Carolyn
I would gladly join u....I am in NV. Sorry dear

they were all being pulled by people mostly. a few with bicycles and two were being pulled by those biofuel vehicles, Greg. our buses here are all environmentally friendly too and on earth day, everyone gets to ride for free.

never mind, LC i did it for both of us :)

Some show of protest: With chants of, "F*** the police" (Re: Michael Brown protesters) and throngs of Communists and radicals demanding, "Revolution, nothing less," it's difficult to understand how anyone could express pride in having participated in such a shameful display of disrespect.

This spectacle of anti-American, anti-Capitalist sentiment had Socialism written all over it...literally! I saw the placards and signs, the militantly radical, socialist newspapers that were being sold at a profit (talk about irony!), the Socialist Workers and even Occupy Wall Street showed to sell some of their worthless T-shirts.

I also think that there were probably tens of thousands, not 400,000 people in attendance.

And what the heck is ecosocialism?

What a farce!

310,000 was the final count, Patrick.

i didn't hear anyone saying f... the police and i didn't see any michael brown protestors or throngs of communists and radicals demanding revolution. it was just not like that at all. it was not anti american nor anti capitalist. it was a peaceful parade of marching bands and floats advertising things like wind power and biofuels and save the trees and save the polar bears and so on and on. all the regular globals stuff. but then, i was there and you were not. ;) i marched with some peaceful japanese monks who were drumming on skins because i felt comfortable with them.

and today this happened, "Today, the Rockefeller family announced that their $860 million philanthropic org will divest from fossil fuels. Two leaders from the divestment movement recently spoke with Bill about how they've gotten a number of institutions to break their ties with the fossil fuel industry." which seems like a good start to me.

the occupy wall street protest was today in wall street, which is quite funny as most of those institutions have moved their headquarters to times square. so i think you got them muddled up.

Some of those 310,000 or so marchers were trying to teach the rest of us - well over a thousand times that number - how we should live our lives, while the truth is, these same, well-intentioned people have no clue what life would be like if they actually got their way.

Perhaps the day will come when we have figured out how to replace the fossil fuels that gave the marchers the means to get to the march, the power to charge their cell phones while they were there and the juice to fire up the equipment that helped in the preparation of their meals while they were away from home - even their clothing was created using fossil fuels - but that day is only a pipe dream today, a day whose arrival cannot be legislated or negotiated with a treaty.

That distant date won't arrive through the efforts of the Algores or the Leo diCaprios; rather, it will come as the result of the hard work and technical knowledge of scientists and engineers - and maybe a few geeks like us - who relentlessly seek a solution to the energy conundrum in which the people of the Earth find themselves.

While other countries are mothballing their renewable energy pursuits, backing away from what they've seen as a very bleak precipice, too many Americans are allowing themselves to be railroaded toward that same, bleak precipice.

And maybe that's been the agenda hidden behind the People's Climate March from the get-go.

Oh I see the march was on sunday the 21st. yes...well i am glad you did it Carolynn. Our earth is important

yes Sunday, LC :) thank you.

you take everything so personally, Patrick. people demonstrate and march because this is a, "free" country where people are allowed to express their opinions. no one is trying to tell individuals how they should live their lives. i doubt anyone cares.

so what you're suggesting is we should all stay at home, not use our computers and sit in front of log fires eating potatoes that we dug from the earth with our fingers. civilization does not allow many of us to live that way anymore but it sure does not hurt to recycle, compost, clean up after ourselves and so on. better a Leo diCaprio try to help rather than not.

if no one had ever protested or stood up for simple rights and beliefs, what an even sadder world we would live in. Patrick. i see you are wearing a nice suit in your photograph. was it hand woven with wool from your own sheep or maybe made out of leaves? no one is forcing you to believe or help change things and you should allow those who want to do that the respect to do what they choose to do too.

Carolyn,

Good to hear that the floats were moved by the means you posted. I would have found it hypocritical if they were moved by fossil-fuel-powered equipment.


"...no one is forcing you to believe or help change things and you should allow those who want to do that the respect to do what they choose to do too."

True, but upon seeing the news media coverage of the event, the images of the trash left behind, namely the signs they carried, and the multitude of cups and other trash not placed in a proper trash receptacle, or at least taken with them when they left, that kind of negates the entire meaning behind the march. It makes the "event" seem hypocritical. It's scenes like that that make me wonder what's the next "cause" some of those people will appear at. I believe it's mostly a social event for a lot of them just to be able to say they were there.

Strictly my personal opinions, and not directed at anyone in particular, just making a blanket statement.

yes, i agree with you on the trash issue, Greg. and in fact, i reprimanded a young man who threw his sign down on the street and made him pick it up again. that kind of behaviour belittles the whole point of the march. i certainly hope that issue will be addressed by the organizers of the march in their future endeavours. sometimes the human race confounds me.

Global warming! Serves you all! Now you will know what it's like to live in Florida.
Anyway to barge a huge iceberg down here? Cool things off......

So they have no problem creating a huge carbon bubble with people, cars and buses I guess. Why is this BS not politics?

Carolyn. Read my post again and discover the answers to your questions on your own:

Some of those 310,000 or so marchers were trying to teach the rest of us - well over a thousand times that number - how we should live our lives, while the truth is, these same, well-intentioned people have no clue what life would be like if they actually got their way.

Perhaps the day will come when we have figured out how to replace the fossil fuels that gave the marchers the means to get to the march, the power to charge their cell phones while they were there and the juice to fire up the equipment that helped in the preparation of their meals while they were away from home - even their clothing was created using fossil fuels - but that day is only a pipe dream today, a day whose arrival cannot be legislated or negotiated with a treaty.

That distant date won't arrive through the efforts of the Algores or the Leo diCaprios; rather, it will come as the result of the hard work and technical knowledge of scientists and engineers - and maybe a few geeks like us - who relentlessly seek a solution to the energy conundrum in which the people of the Earth find themselves.

While other countries are mothballing their renewable energy pursuits, backing away from what they've seen as a very bleak precipice, too many Americans are allowing themselves to be railroaded toward that same, bleak precipice.

And maybe that's been the agenda hidden behind the People's Climate March from the get-go.

i did read it. and responded. "people demonstrate and march because this is a, "free" country where people are allowed to express their opinions. no one is trying to tell individuals how they should live their lives. i doubt anyone cares.

so what you're suggesting is we should all stay at home, not use our computers and sit in front of log fires eating potatoes that we dug from the earth with our fingers. civilization does not allow many of us to live that way anymore but it sure does not hurt to recycle, compost, clean up after ourselves and so on. better a Leo diCaprio try to help rather than not.

if no one had ever protested or stood up for simple rights and beliefs, what an even sadder world we would live in. Patrick. i see you are wearing a nice suit in your photograph. was it hand woven with wool from your own sheep or maybe made out of leaves? no one is forcing you to believe or help change things and you should allow those who want to do that the respect to do what they choose to do too.

perhaps you did not care for my response but i did reply. hidden agendas would be better addressed in the conspiracy theory discussion in Barry's group.

And perhaps this would be better addressed in the same discussion you started there. I'm with Tony, why is this not politics, or did I miss the memo that we are once again allowed to discuss politics?

Carolyn, you did not understand Patrick's post. He has no hidden agendas, it was your reply that contradicted your own beliefs.

Thank you very much for that clarification, Debra...you're a peach!

Sometimes words get in my way when I try too hard to explain something that is intrinsically simple: Brevity is the soul of wit.

Roy, Carolyn, Patrick, and LC,

Things are changing. Technology is moving forward at a rapid pace.

We have many many pollution problems that effect us and other species.

Some of the advances:

This materials database will allow mankind to create new materials that biodegrade. An example
would be coke cola going to these academics and asking for a can that does not seep into the soda, but
biodegrades in three years.

http://newsoffice.mit.edu/2014/materials-database-proves-its-mettle-with-new-discoveries-0204

Professor Donald Sadoway MIT has made at least two major advances.

One a process of making steel without nearly as much CO2 involved.

http://newsoffice.mit.edu/2013/steel-without-greenhouse-gas-emissions-0508

Second a new liquid metal battery made of materials from the earth that are inexpensive
and common.

https://techtv.mit.edu/tags/1528-sadoway/videos/5239-high-performance-rechargeable-batteries-for-sustainable-transportation-and-large-scale-storage-of-ele

We have problems with GMOs and worse SOME nanotechs leach into the econsystems and are very damaging.
We need new studies, laws and practices on how we do things.

A little more than two years ago the human race finally found out how antibiotics work. We are in a race
against time to manage how we fight some bacteria while supporting what might be termed beneficial bacteria.

http://newsoffice.mit.edu/2012/pinpointing-how-antibiotics-work


Dave

thanks, Dave excellent information.

Debra, i do not think i contradicted myself. i did suggest to Patrick that this should not be discussed here but in the group discussion to which he is also privy.

Carolyn, the only one with hidden agendas here is you by starting this thread through a seemingly harmless attempt at getting a petition signed which has turned out coincidentally as a pretense to a highly controversial subject. Everyone else has been open and candid about their feelings. You have brought your derailed discussion from one soap box to another. A forbidden one, I might add. That is a hidden agenda.

As for Patrick's post, it is amazing to me that you still do not understand his point. And what is even more surprising is that you don't understand your own convoluted reply to it.

The audacity is that now you do not think anyone should give their point of view unless it is the same as yours so you suggest that they go away.

are you serious. where did i try to get a petition signed? i was just bringing people's attention to the march. no Debra, no conspiracy theories or hidden agendas here except in your mind. ;)

never assume what others think or understand because you do not know what is in their minds.

Thanks, Debra. With that last post of yours, you've handily identified the symptoms of a malady from which many on the Left suffer, to wit: Just as it is difficult for an alcoholic to acknowledge a diagnosis of their own disease in order that they receive the treatment they need for a cure - from their perspective, it's perfectly normal to abuse booze because that's when they feel most normal - so it is very difficult for the Progressive/Leftist mindset to see other POVs as anything but radical and extremist...to them, the position they've chosen is smack dab in the middle, a well - reasoned and perfectly acceptable place from which to speak their mind on literally anything. Ironically, they've assumed a position that is anything but in the middle; it is they who are guilty of having adopted extremist views, relative to the general populace, rather than those at whom they are continually pointing the fickle finger of blame.

as i suggested already (scroll back) this should be discussed in the group not here if you're going to keep discussing politics. Patrick we can say exactly the same about the GOP/right mindset. mindsets are mindsets. you don't agree with us and vice versa. we're no more guilty than you are of having our own views and ideas and should not be called out on that. that's not a debate. if you'd like to discuss it further, there are a couple of appropriate topics in Barry's group. see you over there.

Were we to assign our respective political mindsets an arbitrary value and plot each of those values using a linear scale and then compare the positions, neither of us would fall in the relative midpoint, yet the Progressive/Leftist would insist that the midpoint be shifted to correspond with the point on the scale at which their values had been plotted.

It's a matter of relativity, Carolyn.

that's another assumption and i could insist the same for the right. but as i keep pointing out, we should not be discussing it here. want to bring it Barry's group?

You said "You can sign up here" and then directed unsuspecting readers to a 3 hour video of protesters postulating for a cause. Nevertheless it does not negate the fact that you wanted to start a debate about global warming. And if you start a debate you should allow all views to be heard and not suggest they go away because they don't happen to agree with you. You should scroll back and read the comments.

that's because they changed their website, debra. the original post was to purely to sign up for the march if you wanted to go. no hidden agendas, and i am not responsible for them subsequently posting a video after the march was over. i am happy to hear all views. i'm not happy to support political facts and debate in this discussion. if you want to bring it over to the group we can discuss it there. i don't believe i've told anyone to go away at all. i have repeatedly suggested we take it to the group and not discuss it here. which i think is fair. therefore i'm not willing to discuss it in here anymore. i really don 't want to get banned for discussing politics in a place where we've been asked not to do that when there is a perfectly good group to discuss this with a similar topic.

let's continue this over here

http://fineartamerica.com/showmessages.php?messageid=2104381

i will close this thread before we get ourselves into trouble ;)